Wasp Attack!!! How do I now feed the bees?

[CliffDale]

2 weeks ago, I added some Apiguard. I thought the colony was quite strong then. Today, I went to remove the trays and found the hive under attack from wasps.

I put a ply board in front of the hive entrance and with in minutes there were about 50 wasps hovering trying to get in.

I peeped inside the crown board and could see bees on the frames, but no bees were flying out of the hive.

I have moved the hive to my home and later I will take a look at the damage.

I could tell it was very light so I need to feed them!

I think its too late to give sugar syrup. I have plenty of fondant to try.

I have not opened the hive but I can see 3 frames of bees through the feeding hole.

Is it possible to save the colony or should I unite?

Edit
I have just had a look and can see 4 frames of bees. They are to one side of the hive. Now I'm thinking to overwinter them in an nuc?

Your thoughts would be appreciated.

Cliff

 

[susbees]

Moving them was a good idea. And there is still time to feed 2:1. They won't need to waste time fetching water.

 

[Storm™]

The wasps have been shocking this year. We have apple trees in the garden. Laden this year. Cooking apple tree go barely any attention. The eaters, obviously sweeter, Jesus. The apples on the tree look ripe and fresh and ready to eat. Touch one though and at least 500 wasps pour out. Same with the windfalls. It's quite sickening. I created a wasp trap with 1 to 1 syrup, and threw in a handful of winegums as an extra attractant. It's a 6 pint milk container. Now I have five Pints of drowned wasps. We share the garden with a 2 year old and if he even ventured near the trees they went ape. Even working through the night which is when it was sort of safer to place the trap. It's working even better now all the apples have been consumed. Lesson for me is - remove all windfalls and harvest apples as soon as possible. I watched it for some time, the birds would make a hole and the wasps became so prolific around that hole that the birds were forced to move onto another apple. After a few days the apple became totally full up with wasps. That brought in the hornets. So it has been no go in that area of the garden.

 

[Heather]

Frame feed to let them feed without venturing out for a while - reduce the entrance to 2 bee size to allow guards to cope.

If they are small after 2 more weeks I would transfer to a 5/7 frame Nuc for the winter- but keep feeding them-

 

[CliffDale]

Flippin ek!

Wasps found them already! Only one wasp in the pic, the rest are bees!

This time the bees are keeping them out. I think I will reduce some more.

Cliff

 

[Spomenko]

Wasps love the taste and smell beer. Leave a little liquid in the bottle, put next to the hive, erect.Vary the liquid when the wasps drown every day.

 

[Hebeegeebee]

f the colony has been hammered by wasp attack - and they are still getting in, close up for 3 days and feed some syrup as they are light. By this time the wasps will have got bored and gone to annoy something else, we hope. In addition the colony will have recovered some of it's self-reliance and a few more guard bees will have matured. The opening should be 1 or 2 bee spaces - that's all. There is then a good chance that they will be able to defend themselves. If the colony is small, put in a smaller hive or pack out the space with insulation material so they don't have so much room to heat. They will probably need feeding with fondant over winter. Ensure that you can do this with your new hive hardware if you re-hive the colony. (Do you have an eke for the nuc you intend to use for example).


If there is brood, a queen and a decent number of bees, there's no reason why the colony should not last the winter. A 5 frame nuc is quite viable for overwintering. You could possibly nick a couple of frames of stores from other colonies if they are well supplied to suppliment what they have got now.

 

[Hebeegeebee]

Wasps love the taste and smell beer..

Problem is, so do I.

 

[apkfjk]

This is really useful info. My hive has also been under attack the last two days, only noticed on Saturday afternoon, reduced entrance size down so only 1 or 2 wide at max, but the wasps are relentless.

I will try the beer or sweet fizzy drink suggestion to see if that draws them off, but won't the bees be interested in that aswell?

Don't know where the wasps are coming from, as not in my roof, so must be a neighbours, but cautious that they do not steal too much from my hive.

Are there any other suggestions that may help? I have tried to stand next to the hive entrance and swat the wasps, but as I say they are relentless, kill one five appear....

 

[Monsieur Abeille]

This is really useful info. My hive has also been under attack the last two days, only noticed on Saturday afternoon, reduced entrance size down so only 1 or 2 wide at max, but the wasps are relentless.

I will try the beer or sweet fizzy drink suggestion to see if that draws them off, but won't the bees be interested in that aswell?

Don't know where the wasps are coming from, as not in my roof, so must be a neighbours, but cautious that they do not steal too much from my hive.

Are there any other suggestions that may help? I have tried to stand next to the hive entrance and swat the wasps, but as I say they are relentless, kill one five appear....

With the entrance that small they shouldnt be able to get in, and should therefore give up.

Otherwise various recipes on the site for wasp trap fills - fruit juices, cider, beer, fruit squash, catfood, fruit - take your pick. Bees aren't interested in any of it, especially if you put a drop of booze or vinegar in.

Easiest effective trap is to cut the top off a large fizzy drink bottle at the shoulder, half fill with trap of choice and tape the inverted lid back on. Normally shouldn't be left too near hive as it can attract wasps but it sounds like you are beyond that.

In extreamis get some rat glue traps smeared with jam - very effective but you need to leave in a place where they are not likely to catch birds or other non threatening beasts which will be difficult this time of year.

If you want to find the wasps source, some have suggested on here sprinkling the wasps with some talc or flour making it easier to see their flight home (which tends to be direct)

 

[Firefly]

I had also considered re-hiving a rather weak post-swarm, post-thymol, post-wasp attack colony to a nuc for the winter, but decided against it on the grounds that

• my (WBC) hive is of course double-wall, my nuc is not
• surface-area to volume ratio is greater in a nuc, so it cools more quickly in cold weather
• easier to feed fondant in a hive, as implied by (Hebeegeebee)
• empty brood comb sounds to me like pretty good insulation
• moving bees must be stress-inducing (for the bees!)
• whenever we discuss OMF's people say "leave the OMF open in winter because bees don't mind the cold"!

Should I re-consider?

Should I break the rules and put in the OMF inspection tray for the winter?

Thanks for your thoughts
David

 

[Monsieur Abeille]

I had also considered re-hiving a rather weak post-swarm, post-thymol, post-wasp attack colony to a nuc for the winter, but decided against it on the grounds that

• my (WBC) hive is of course double-wall, my nuc is not
• surface-area to volume ratio is greater in a nuc, so it cools more quickly in cold weather
• easier to feed fondant in a hive, as implied by (Hebeegeebee)
• empty brood comb sounds to me like pretty good insulation
• moving bees must be stress-inducing (for the bees!)
• whenever we discuss OMF's people say "leave the OMF open in winter because bees don't mind the cold"!

Should I re-consider?

Should I break the rules and put in the OMF inspection tray for the winter?

Thanks for your thoughts
David

Those in the know will want to know the size of the colony - just how small.

Main thing to consider imo is the hive volume the bees will have to work at to keep it at a liveable temperature. A 5 frame nuc is easier to keep warm than a 10 or 11 frame full brood box, so unless you are removing all unused frames and packing both sides with insulated divider boards they will probably be better off in a nuc.

Your points in question though:

[*]my (WBC) hive is of course double-wall, my nuc is not
Some protection from the elements, but not really much difference in terms of insulation - which is as well as you dont want the walls of the hive to be warmer than the roof for condensation.


surface-area to volume ratio is greater in a nuc, so it cools more quickly in cold weather
Nope. Frames will maintain temperature longer than air.

easier to feed fondant in a hive, as implied by (Hebeegeebee)
Zillions of nucs go through winter being fed by a slab on the top of the frames or, it seems, in a frame feeder

empty brood comb sounds to me like pretty good insulation
Not really. Better to not have any wasted space


moving bees must be stress-inducing (for the bees!)
True, but if you do it when its not too cold and are quick a few minutes of stress is better than a winter of chill

whenever we discuss OMF's people say "leave the OMF open in winter because bees don't mind the cold"!
More importantly because it allows for ventilation.

 

[Hivemaker.]

Should I re-consider?

Best to transfer them into a nuc David,warmer and easy to place fondant right above the cluster if needed. For example i would not be transferring queens/bees that are currently set to over winter in kielers or apideas into a WBC or any other large hive, because they would overwinter better than what they are already in,because they would not.

 

[apkfjk]

Thanks Monsieur Abeille

That has certainly helped, will try and fashion a trap tonight.

Knowing the entrance reduction should be a help is of comfort.

Not sure about the talc bit, may just have a wander round a few hours near me and see if I can see anything. Once I know the wasp attacks have decreased I'll add fondant to perhaps help with any stores that have been scavenged

 

[Firefly]

Those in the know will want to know the size of the colony - just how small.

The weather forecast says it will be sunny and 17C at 16:00 today. I think I'll take a good look see

I may be back

 

[Hebeegeebee]

This is really useful info. My hive has also been under attack the last two days, only noticed on Saturday afternoon, reduced entrance size down so only 1 or 2 wide at max, but the wasps are relentless.

I will try the beer or sweet fizzy drink suggestion to see if that draws them off, but won't the bees be interested in that aswell?

Don't know where the wasps are coming from, as not in my roof, so must be a neighbours, but cautious that they do not steal too much from my hive.

Are there any other suggestions that may help? I have tried to stand next to the hive entrance and swat the wasps, but as I say they are relentless, kill one five appear....

As I wrote before - try closing the hive for a couple of days.