Waiting for mating.....

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What was the longest time of waiting
from hatching till sucsessfull maiting
of virgin in your bee career ?
([FONT=&quot]Forgive[/FONT], my poetry is … weird :) )
 
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What was the longest time of waiting
from hatching till sucsessfull maiting
of virgin in your bee career ?
([FONT=&quot]Forgive[/FONT], my poetry is … weird :) )

A queen is sexually mature 6 days after emergence.
1st CO2 exposure is 24 hours before, or after, insemination. I usually do it before.
2nd CO2 exposure is during insemination.
Usually the queen lays within a couple of days...lets say 2 weeks to be generous.
If a queen isn't laying after 2 weeks, I'll try another CO2 exposure, but, if she's not laying by 3 weeks, I'll check her spermatheca for a failed insemination.
 
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Longest time to wait.... Up to Cristmas.

4 weeks is enough to wait mating. Then it is better to do something else than try waiting record.
 
Thanks all responded
What whether books or articles would you B+ recommend for those who is interested in artificial insemination? Are there any whether courses or practices available in UK (or even Ireland, if I may hope ;) )
I mentioned successful mating, Finnman ;) … It might be successful at an artificial insemination in Christmas I presume though :)
So the longest time for a virgin not to be mated is one month from hatching, is it? Should we get rid of her after that( If she`s not mated of course)?
 
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Thanks all responded
What whether books or articles would you B+ recommend for those who is interested in artificial insemination? Are there any whether courses or practices available in UK (or even Ireland, if I may hope ;) )
I mentioned successful mating, Finnman ;) … It might be successful at an artificial insemination in Christmas I presume though :)
So the longest time for a virgin not to be mated is one month from hatching, is it? Should we get rid of her after that( If she`s not mated of course)?

Pretty much. I wouldn't keep a virgin that long.
I believe that there is a chap in Scotland who teaches II. Michael Collier does/did too but I'm not sure if he still does. You can also go to one of the Bee Institutes in Germany or, if you go to the US, Sue Cobey is an acknowledged expert.
As far as Instruments, you have the choice of the Latshaw simplified process http://latshawapiaries.com/ or the Schley instrument http://www.besamungsgeraet.de/__en/catalog-equipments/. This is the one I use. Swienty have their own design http://www.swienty.com/shop/default.asp?catid=1188 but I have never used this.
Personally, I find Friedrich Ruttners book "The Instrumental Insemination of the Queen Bee" (Apimondia 1976) to be about the best.
Otto Mackenson & W.C. Roberts "A manual for the artificial insemination of Queen Bees" republished by Northern Bee Books in 2013 was originally published by the USDA. A bit thin IMHO.
Harry H. Laidlaw Jr. "Instrumental Insemination of Honey Bee Queens" (Pictorial Instructional Manual) was originally published in 1977 but was also republished by Northern Bee Books in 2013
 
Pretty much. I wouldn't keep a virgin that long.
I believe that there is a chap in Scotland who teaches II. This is the one I use. Swienty have their own design

Got to say I admire anyone doing II. Having looked into it it's not the kit, but the faffing about preparing bees, havi ng enought queens etc plus all the little extras that you need too. For a small scale operation like me, just not the solution.
Hats off to those that do.

Far simpler for me to spend some time this summer testing a few potential isolated mating sites deep within N.Yorks moors. Assuming the queen rearing goes to plan....but as nothing else has this season, at least weather wise...
 
Thanks again B+. It looks like it`s not a very popular practice in our islands though… :(
For those who is interested: free PDF file: INSTRUMENTAL INSEMINATION OF QUEEN BEES, OTTO MACKENSEN AND KENNETH W.TUCKER Agriculture Handbook No. 390
Washington, D.C. December 1970
:
http://naldc.nal.usda.gov/download/CAT87209055/PDF
 
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Thanks again B+. It looks like it`s not a very popular practice in our islands though… :(

You're welcome.
As Thymallus indicated, you have to be quite dedicated to do this sort of work.
The equipment isn't cheap but access to the breeding material is probably the hardest part. I think most people are happy keeping bees and getting a bit of honey. Not everyone wants to breed bees.
 
Far simpler for me to spend some time this summer testing a few potential isolated mating sites deep within N.Yorks moors. Assuming the queen rearing goes to plan....but as nothing else has this season, at least weather wise...

If you manage to find an area where your virgin queens don't mate (i.e. no drones within range) you'll stand a good chance at being able to control mating.

I haven't been happy with the air temperature either. I delayed setting up my cell builder until this morning: 18 Langstroth frames of brood, 1 good frame of pollen and 1 frame of open nectar (with the odd patch of pollen/nectar on the brood frames). All adhering bees plus as many extra frames of nurse bees as I could spare all combine to provide a very good start for my grafts. Now, all we need is the right weather
 
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If you manage to find an area where your virgin queens don't mate (i.e. no drones within range) you'll stand a good chance at being able to control mating.
Exactly what I intend to do. I have a few sites where I have access and are possibles. We shall see.
 
Thanks again B+. It looks like it`s not a very popular practice in our islands though… :(
For those who is interested: free PDF file: INSTRUMENTAL INSEMINATION OF QUEEN BEES, OTTO MACKENSEN AND KENNETH W.TUCKER Agriculture Handbook No. 390
Washington, D.C. December 1970
:
http://naldc.nal.usda.gov/download/CAT87209055/PDF
Looking at the Contents page, it looks almost identical to my printed copy.
Save yourself some money - download this instead! ;-)
Ruttner has a much better guide though
 
Dear Jimmys Mum,

I performed an artificial swarm on my strongest colony in late April and decided to try using a Snelgrove Board for the first time. When I inspected the relevant brood box on 2 May, a virgin queen had emerged from its cell. I then refrained from looking again until today (12 May) when I found eggs in about 10 cells, all in a row at the bottom of a frame. There was a single egg in all but one of these cells, and that one contained three eggs at the centre of the cell floor. All the bees were astonishingly well behaved. I assume that I have a recently-mated queen in there and that she might even have started laying eggs for the very first time today. Presumably, she inadvertently released more than one egg on one of these occasions, which I understand can happen when queens have only recently started laying. (Had I shaken the frames a bit harder, it is possible that I might have found more eggs but I saw no real need to do so).

The maximum daily temperatures recorded at a reasonably local weather station, in degrees Celcius from 2 May until today, were 13, 18, 15, 14, 13, 15, 15, 16, 15, 19 and 15 (Source: wunderground.com) . Mean daily temperatures over the same timeframe were 8, 14, 12, 12, 10, 10, 10, 12, 11, 14 and 12. It would seem that this provided sufficient opportunity for successful mating flights. Various caveats apply regarding those actual readings and further caveats apply with regard to their application to my newly-mated queen. However, if several of us collected the equivalent data each time we performed an artificial swarm, within a year or two we might be able to provide a reasonably validated “rough and ready” forum-generated answer to your original question.

Hope all goes well with your six virgin queens!
 
Thanks for that feedback Icing Sugar. I'll not worry just yet then. It seems that your queen didn't wait for the magical 20 on the thermometer, she just got on with it! I'm sure mine will be fine. It's actually been a pretty good week here so far! So fingers crossed.
 
Thanks for that feedback Icing Sugar. I'll not worry just yet then. It seems that your queen didn't wait for the magical 20 on the thermometer, she just got on with it! I'm sure mine will be fine. It's actually been a pretty good week here so far! So fingers crossed.
Queens can definitely get mated below 20. If it's still and sunny, even below 18 sometimes. Don't panic there's bound to be some suitable weather soon.
 
If bees mated only at over 20C, I would have no mated queens till July.. Apart from a spell in April, 18C is the warmest we have seen.. Two queens have mated in May...
 
If bees mated only at over 20C, I would have no mated queens till July.. Apart from a spell in April, 18C is the warmest we have seen.. Two queens have mated in May...

Once I followed 10 queens at same time. Two of them mated in 18C temp and the rest of queens mated a week later when temps rised over 20C.

Of course every one may live according miracles and extremes but my experience is that it must be calm sunny day and temp 20C. That is my basic knowledge about this thing.

If some queens mate in 18C temp, that suits to me. Queen need 1-3 good days to mate. I have seen a queen which mate inside 4 days because it was 2 rainy days between two good days.
 
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