Some good advice needed re treatment.

[BrianO]

OK

Been an extremely tough couple of months , with the passing of my mother last week due to a recent cancer diagnoisis.

Bees have not been attended to as a result.

Only this week had the presecnce and enthusiasm to start back , had been keeping an eye on them but no more over last number of weeks.

Monday did inspect one of four hives and removed my first ever honey which gave me a bit of a lift in the form of 7 super frames, beautifully capped.

Now not sure what to do, at this stage in the season. Bees have not been treated, all four hives doing well.

Is is to late to treat ?

If not Apiguard or MAQs strips ?

Am coming more around after my first year nearly complete, to less interfering and more observation.

An interesting first year in which I was sold a full hive complete with charged queen cell on the cusp of swarming by an *unhelpful supplier*. Managed to AS that and ended up with 2 healthy colonies, the original having successfully mated the newly hatched virgin queen. All colonies now going strong with BIAS. Weather been fantastic here so up until now bees been piling in with pollen to feed brood.
Other two colonies bought as Nucs and since hived up all in Nationals.

Planning on assessing each hive and feeding with Apinvert as necessary by this weekend, and , based on advice I hopefully get here treating or not.

Thanks very much in advance.

 

[Amari]

Well done Brian in your first year - nice to hear that your four colonies are thriving whereas many posts (including some of my own) are tales of woe and disaster!
You are likely to get different answers to your question. Most would advise that it's too late for Apiguard because temperatures likely to be too low over the requisite 4 weeks. Some will say (?on flimsy evidence) that it's too late for MAQ. How about inserting varroa boards and if the drop is heavy over 2 days then treat with MAQ. If light drop then wait till early January and apply oxalic acid. Mind you, many report poor correlation between varroa drop and the true colony varroa load.

 

[Arfermo]

As an alternative given the circs you could try an early oxalic dose if (a)the queen has stopped laying and there is no brood which needs to be kept to carry the hive thought to spring and (b)the mite drop is severe enough to justify action sooner than the normal early Jan dose of oxalic. Your choice I'm afraid between taking action or not as usual.

 

[oliver90owner]

One to four in a season is good, but apart from your A/S start in early June I am not sure when the other two arrived

So, cannot comment on chances through the winter, but I would still be treating with thymol even this late. Remember the brood nest will still be at thirty something, even if the rest is cooler. It may mean oxalic trickle would be good later, when broodless.

I don't use apiguard and apply thymol according to the weather, so my thymol treatments are, hopefully, of far better efficacy than the commercial treatment. I reckon they are always as good and mostly better.

Tuck them up with full boxes of stores and adequate insulation, is my advice, as we don't really know how strong your colonies are - newbies often over-estimate colony strength so don't take that as a criticism.

You have likely not missed a lot these past few weeks and now need to get them full of stores - sugar syrup with thymol would be good for nosema prevention/control or fondant if it is getting too late for them to reduce syrup water content to honey levels. Any part-filled shallow frames may be better nadired if the box will not be filled by autumn feeding, rather than risk leaving excessive un-filled space above the cluster.

You seem to have been a quick learner and have taken note of advice offered. Congrats and well done in such a difficult time.

RAB

 

[Skyhook]

I would definitely treat. The temperatures are dropping a bit, so some insulation over the crownboard will help. Personally I'm using thymol, but either of the others should be fine.

I also treat with Oxalic in the winter, as belt and braces, but leaving it until then can mean them going into winter in poor shape.

.

 

[itma]

Definitely plan on Oxalic in midwinter.

Before then, since you are on standard nationals and have removed the supers, I'd suggest a half dose of MAQS - just one strip for each colony.
That should reduce the varroa somewhat - and quickly - before you start feeding. At minimal risk to the colonies (IMHO 2 strips can be a bit much for a single national with no supers …)

Since you have commercial invert syrup available, you needn't rush to feed. The bees take that stuff quickly, even really late when the weather is turning decidedly damp.
Better that you hold back (unless they are very light right now) and let the bees take maximum advantage of the Ivy etc.
Meanwhile, check on your feeding equipment. Can you feed four colonies simultaneously? Feeder boards, feeders, ekes or empty supers … and practice your 'hefting' by comparing what weight you feel with the amount of stores that you see when you inspect. Learn the 'feel' of what you are seeing, so you can visualise just from the feel when you can't inspect in midwinter.
Standard national should end up something like 8/11ths full of stores - pretty well full (and feeling like it has been nailed down!)

 

[midnight sun]

Nice reply RAB.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I would go for apiguard - may not be as effective as earlier on but will still work. A lot of beeks around here have only just started on their treatment with thymol. Would almost definitely use OA midwinter though in this case.

 

[BrianO]

Brilliant replies , really appreciated ! Just back after buying MAQS with intention this weekend of using 1 strip , thanks JB also saw your reply after buying MAQS

What a great forum this is populated by helpful people , a bit "gushing" yes !! but heh life's short and so many people are so helpful.

Took another 5 frames off another hive in second apiary I have ( 2 sites, each with 2 hives ).... So now the proud owner of a full super of 11capped frames !

Got carried away and ordered an extractor ( for future more so ) bought jars lids and. ordering labels tomorrow.

Took frames off today without smoking , they got a bit excited but happier knowing they are not panic gorging on honey, fascinating little critters, couldn't take suit off as one little kamikaze merchant followed me for about 20 metres pinging off my veil, just the one !

Thanks again all

 

[Arfermo]

Got a bad dose of nosema apis on one hive by the look of it - first day out in numbers and **** all over the entrance. Too early for shook swarm into new box & frames or is there something better for this time of year - or merely wait till spring really comes? pms welcome please.

 

[masterBK]

One of the problems with shook swarm for Nosema control is that the bees tend to defaecate on the new comb after being stressed by the shaking process. Bailey developed comb change to "save" Nosemic colonies . Too early for either method. If you have several colonies is it worth trying to save the odd infected one?

 

[Arfermo]

One of the problems with shook swarm for Nosema control is that the bees tend to defaecate on the new comb after being stressed by the shaking process. Bailey developed comb change to "save" Nosemic colonies . Too early for either method. If you have several colonies is it worth trying to save the odd infected one?

Thanks but your reply is rather what I thought but I haven't got so many hives that I would not regret not having even tried to save it. This is actually the largest and well provisioned hive I've got too - really buzzing at every opportunity. My best bet I reckon is to wait for a warmer day and then risk a shook swarm and feed thymolised syrup and then cross fingers. I'll wait for more clues from those experts on here who might be along in a minute and have better ideas that are worth a try. Don't like Bailey change much as it takes too long.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Is it worth trying thymolated syrup spray?
I know it's early but............
The thymol mix recommended to treat the bees is 5ml of Hivemaker's pre mix to 1L of 1:1 syrup lightly sprayed over the bees and combs every 4 days three times.

 

[Beeline]

In these temps I'd advise against shook swarm and treat only with thymol spray as Erichalfbee suggests. Had to recently transfer a colony that was never that strong going into winter, into a nuc. The temps weren't good. All the shaking suddenly caused them to start pooing all over the place. Although I cleaned it up, in the days following this, they continued to poo everywhere.

I took some advice and used HMs thymol solution as per above concentration. Opened them up last weekend in the brief sunshine we had and gave each frame of bees a liberal spray of solution. Cleaned the outside with a strong solution of washing soda, washed off with water.

I can happily report not a single trace of poo on the outside this week so it seems to have worked.

 

[Arfermo]

Is it worth trying thymolated syrup spray?
I know it's early but............
The thymol mix recommended to treat the bees is 5ml of Hivemaker's pre mix to 1L of 1:1 syrup lightly sprayed over the bees and combs every 4 days three times.

Thanks to you and Beeline. Sounds good - will try. Hadn't intended to do shook swarm just yet anyway. Was thinking of leaving them bee for 3 weeks or so and then doing it - but will try your idea first. Now to find Hivemakers recipe - again!!

Afternote edit: Can't trace Hivemekers premix. Clue please somebody.

 

[Arfermo]

Is it worth trying thymolated syrup spray?
I know it's early but............
The thymol mix recommended to treat the bees is 5ml of Hivemaker's pre mix to 1L of 1:1 syrup lightly sprayed over the bees and combs every 4 days three times.

Yes please but can't find Hivemaker's recipe. Clue please.

 

[Pete D]

Look on the main index page, fourth section down called stickies, it's the first one.
Good luck

 

[Arfermo]

Cockeyed post deleted.