Solid Floor & Roof Insulation

[Spikedog]

Any suggestions (other than open the floor) on how to insulate (under roof) a solid floor hive with ventilation via crown board feed hole to vents in roof? Insulation 2” will cover feed hole & vents. Crown board feed hole presently covered by mesh. Bees have not propolised so imagine they value it. Thinking of hole in insulation to tiny space between it and roof. Any old hand experience about?

 

[Finman]

Any suggestions (other than open the floor) on how to insulate (under roof) a solid floor hive with ventilation via crown board feed hole to vents in roof? Insulation 2” will cover feed hole & vents. Crown board feed hole presently covered by mesh. Bees have not propolised so imagine they value it. Thinking of hole in insulation to tiny space between it and roof. Any old hand experience about?

I think that is time to use own brains...
System is too complicated to me to understand.

Basicly I have wooden board 9 mm
Then 50-70 mm insulation

Air gap to ventilate concensation water from loft
Rain roof.

No holes or ventilation on topmost part of the hive.

15 mm ventilation hole/entrance in the middle of front Wall.

Same system whole year around.

 

[Hivemaker.]

Put insulation in roof, block off any roof vents, they are not needed, cover feed hole completely whenever not in use for feeding.

 

[oliver90owner]

I think Hivemaker means crown board vents, not roof vents. Roof vents are only needed to allow any moisture, collected above the crownboard - for whatever reason - to dissipate, thereby avoiding the risk of rot in that area.

In the summer, they may allow heated air (from direct sunshine) below the roof to escape from above the crownboard and reduce the heat conducted into the hive. They have no other use in a hive.

With regards to open holes above the hive, think about it - do bees in trees need a hole above their nest? I don’t think so1

RAB

 

[Hivemaker.]

I think Hivemaker means crown board vents, not roof vents.

Richard, I mean roof vents, non of ours have any vents/holes in them at all, no damp or rot problems either, solid sloping floors with the only ventilation via the entrance.

 

[Spikedog]

Gentlemen, thank you, obliged for insightful advice and will comply (or Wilco as stated when keeping death of roads) P

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Put insulation in roof, block off any roof vents, they are not needed, cover feed hole completely whenever not in use for feeding.

 

[Finman]

.
In out climate cold winter is 6 months when bees do not clean dead bees out from floor. IT is possible that ice and dead bees stop ventilation via the main entrance.

Snow too can stuck the entrance for several days. That is why 15 mm good in the front wall.

In Canada beeks use such system.

 

[Poly Hive]

As above and make some mesh floors over winter ready for next season and join the 21st C.

PH

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

As above and make some mesh floors over winter ready for next season and join the 21st C.

PH

OMF or solid floor - makes little difference to the bees. I have both.

 

[Poly Hive]

Just ignore the research. No worries.

PH

 

[user 6228]

Just ignore the research. No worries.

PH

which research? climate change?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I prefer to ignore him - easier and more rewarding.

 

[TooBee...]

Just ignore the research. No worries.

PH

What research? Can you provide Links to studies, etc. on comparisons between Closed and Open Floors? I've only come across one good research article and the results were firmly inconclusive, meaning there was little difference either way (the advantages and disadvantages canceled each other out).

 

[Griffo]

Over last winter I lost 3 out of 4 hives. I had OMF, with 2 inch Kingspan on top of the crown boards. However, in February I put in a pack of fondant directly on top of the frames with a shallow eke to space out the crown board to make room for the fondant. I suspect this resulted in cold air both around and above the cluster.
This year I have the bottom boards in, restricted entrance, insulation as before, and fondant will go on top of crown board if they need it.

 

[Swarm]

Over last winter I lost 3 out of 4 hives. I had OMF, with 2 inch Kingspan on top of the crown boards. However, in February I put in a pack of fondant directly on top of the frames with a shallow eke to space out the crown board to make room for the fondant. I suspect this resulted in cold air both around and above the cluster.
This year I have the bottom boards in, restricted entrance, insulation as before, and fondant will go on top of crown board if they need it.

Consider changing your roofs for abelo poly roofs, they are a snug fit and are all the insulation you need. When it comes to feeding fondant, there is a recess inside the roof that provides the space.

 

[SDM]

Over last winter I lost 3 out of 4 hives. I had OMF, with 2 inch Kingspan on top of the crown boards. However, in February I put in a pack of fondant directly on top of the frames with a shallow eke to space out the crown board to make room for the fondant. I suspect this resulted in cold air both around and above the cluster.
This year I have the bottom boards in, restricted entrance, insulation as before, and fondant will go on top of crown board if they need it.

Surely the dead space of the eke would initially need heating but would then be a sealed trapped mass of air still well insulated from above and would actually have been ultimately warmer.
Ignore me, i missed the " directly onto the frames" part. I feed fondant through a hole in my clear poly crown boards. Still directly on the frames but the brood area is still sealed.from above

 

[madasafish]

I use OMF (with varroa boards in over winter and insulation 5cms below that) and insulated solid wooden floors and non insulated solid wooden floors.

No discernible differences (ditto under and normal entrances).. All hives either poly or wood with poly cosies. No ventilation holes . 100mm roof insulation.. Zero chance of any internal draughts . Zero winter hive losses this year.

 

[Poly Hive]

Read Mobus on Wintering which I have mentioned many times here over the years.

If you have nothing positive to say say nothing.

PH

 

[TooBee...]

Read Mobus on Wintering which I have mentioned many times here over the years.

If you have nothing positive to say say nothing.

PH

You're referring to this
https://poly-hive.co.uk/recourses/m...intering/brood-rearing-in-the-winter-cluster/
and this
https://poly-hive.co.uk/recourses/m...-wintering/damp-condensation-and-ventilation/

But apart from this website I haven't been able to find any links, and very few references, to this person's writings, does anyone else have copies of his published articles?