Snelgrove method

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isc26

House Bee
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Hi,

I'm intending to try to use a snelgrove board as swarm control this summer. This is mainly due to lack of space in my apiary to do an artificial swarm.

Have been trying to find details of method. Below ( in italics) is the best explanation I have found. Would anyone like to comment on its accuracy/effectiveness who has experience of using this method.

p.s. Yes I know there must be easier ways.

Snelgrove designed a piece of equipment called a Snelgrove Board (the coincidences never cease!). A Snelgrove Board (SgB) is a piece of equipment very much like an inner cover with a few "extras".
Rather than a hole in the center of an inner cover, the SgB has a much larger opening that is double screened, hence a SgB is sometimes referred to as a double screen board.
Additionally, a SgB has entrances on three sides of the board on both top and bottom (six in total). The side with no entrances is the front of the board.
For later discussion imaging that the top entrances are numbered 1, 3 and 5 for the right, back and left entrances and the bottom entrances are numbered 2, 4 and 6 for the right, back and left respectively.
Towards the beginning of swarming season a SgB is used in combination with a queen excluder and hive manipulations on a double brood chamber colony to simulate a swarm while keeping both the parent population and swarming population combined at the same location!
How is this possible?
The hive manipulations consist of segregating the brood frames so those with eggs, larvae and brood are moved to the top hive body and empty frames are segregated to the lower body.
This is another technique that hinges on finding the queen. When she is found she is moved to the lower brood chamber on a frame of eggs, larvae and unsealed brood. This should be the only frame in the lower brood chamber with any stages of brood - all other frames in the lower brood chamber should be empty or contain only stores (pollen, nectar and honey).
Above the bottom brood chamber go a queen excluder, super(s), and the top brood chamber containing occupied brood frames.
Three days later the super(s) will be occupied and the nurse bees will have passed through the queen excluder to the brood frames in the top chamber.
At this point in time the SgB is inserted with entrance 1 open - all other entrances on the SgB are closed. For the next few days, field bees from the top brood chamber will exit through entrance 1 and join the population below the SgB by using the original front entrance.
One week after the initial manipulation the beekeeper closes entrance 1 and opens entrances 2 and 5. Thus, the bees from the top brood chamber that "graduated" to field bees return to and reinforce the lower population by using entrance 2.
During the next week the top brood chamber bees that become field bees will get accustomed to using entrance 5. While the bees in the lower chamber use either the original front entrance or entrance 2.
At the end of the second week the beekeeper closes entrances 2 and 5 and opens entrances 3 and 6. Again the top brood chamber field bees reinforce the lower population by returning to the left hand lower entrance (entrance 6) and the top back entrance (entrance 3) becomes the top brood chamber's main entrance.
By using the entrances in the SgB in a round- robin fashion, the top brood chamber becomes a "bee generator" for the lower colony.
The top brood chamber, being queenless and initially containing all the eggs, larvae and brood will immediately commence to raise a new queen. However, the top brood chamber will not swarm because the population never reaches sufficient numbers to cast a swarm. The bottom chamber never swarms because the brood rearing cycle was interrupted by the initial manipulations.
This method artificially casts a swarm from a colony, keeps both populations in a single unit, effectively sets up a two queen colony, and leaves a requeened colony at the end of the season when the upper and lower chambers are reunited.
 
yep, that's how they are supposed to work!

good luck, and keep us posted on progress
 
lack of space in my apiary to do an artificial swarm.

Sorry, but my suggestion is another apiary in excess of 3 miles from the present one.

But if you must 'Snelgrove', have fun!

Regards, RAB
 
I have got his book and made his Sgb, I have not yet used it - too labour intensive. If you do use it I urge you to write down the manipulations AND the dates on which they are to be done, Soooo easy to get out of sync:willy_nilly:
 
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Talk about making life difficult for yourself.

Are you honestly telling me you haven't room for a nuc box next to your hive.

If you have, I will give you a much simpler method.

PH
 
Why don't you just demaree and use a split board if you want increase? That way you're just going 'vertical' and not increasing your apiary footprint.
 
Have used SB successfully over the last couple of seasons.
Be prepared for some extra manipulations and heavy lifting though!

You need to be very organised and methodical.

Peter
 
If you know you are going to be on the location for sure for the length of time it takes with no risk of life suddenly biting you then by all means play iwth the snelgrove system.

However if there is any risk at all that you are going to have to be absent...


Forget it as a real faff.

Why spend days and days opening and shutting little doors when in one operation you can find the queen, nuc her and leaving one young open cell the job is done.

Sorry I forget some people LIKE playing. Shame for the bees though.

PH
 
If your bees do intend to swarm and you do an AS. should you move the swarmed bees to a different location even if you have room in your present location?
 
If you know you are going to be on the location for sure for the length of time it takes with no risk of life suddenly biting you then by all means play iwth the snelgrove system.

However if there is any risk at all that you are going to have to be absent...


Forget it as a real faff.

Why spend days and days opening and shutting little doors when in one operation you can find the queen, nuc her and leaving one young open cell the job is done.

Sorry I forget some people LIKE playing. Shame for the bees though.

PH

Alternatively, if your spce is as limited as you suggest, it would be simpler to clip the queen and squish her when she falls out of the hive. All the other bees will then go back where they came from along with all the stores they were about to abscond with. Whether you limit the number of queen cells still within the old hive is your choice but contrary to PolyHives suggestion, I would leave minimum of two. Either way the bees will sort it out for you if you let them. As for the Snelgrove, best of luck but a real pain in the butt. Not my sort of fun and a steep learning curve.
 
I read in one of my bee books about someone going round to see Snelgrove back in the day, but he was out collecting his own swarms in his orchard. I fear life is a bit too short me thinks
 
If your bees do intend to swarm and you do an AS. should you move the swarmed bees to a different location even if you have room in your present location?

Part of the operation is to put the 'swarmed' queen on the original hive position, queenless part to one side? Difficult, if you move them to another site.

RAB
 
Poly Hive, I am A newbe, and my biggest worry is swarming, what is this other simplier method using a nuc box?
 
Find q. Place in nuc with three frames of brood and a very good shake of bees.

Replace spaces in brood box with foundation.

Search carefully and remove all the sealed cells, and leave but ONE open cell, the younger the better.

Job done.

Leaving two cells is not a great idea as a, they may fight, and b, may leave the colony in a swarm mood. I always leave one.

By the time your open cell hatches 12 days or so has passed, and by the time she mates, another 21 days may have gone, and by that time there will be no sealed brood left, and a decreasing population, and swarming should be over.

PH
 
"Search carefully and remove all the sealed cells, and leave but ONE open cell, the younger the better."

i thought that if the bees deemed themselves queenless then they would build quick emergency cells which produce small undesirable queens. Surely it is better to leave an intact swarm cell? or does the fact that the bees were planning to swarm and then become queenless ensure that they continue making suitable queens?
 
We are discussing a colony which is in swarm mode.

There will be a range of cells, and a much reduced laying up, if any.

Ideally there will be no fresh eggs. In that event then dumping all the sealed cells, (you can make up one frame nucs for instance to avoid waste but of course then you are propagating a swarmy strain...) you are calming the colony down.

They need time to forget the sex impulse. Hence using an open cell. For that matter you can wait until the eggs have all hatched, the larvae too old to use and fgive a frame or a graft from a colony that is not swarmy.

Time is your ally here.

PH
 
Nuke Swarm Control

Hi, has anyone found , using the nuke method of swarm control, that virgin queens take a long time to mate due to the large size of the colony?Ainsie
 
They will yes. Which is the point of the mini nuc mating systems.

However bear in mind time here is your ally. You don't really want that fast a mating, you want time for everything to settle down, and also remember what is going on in your nuc box... the old queen is working away like a good un thinking she has swarmed.

Unite later, and job done.

PH
 

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