shaking out

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beepig

House Bee
Joined
Mar 10, 2014
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Location
Pembrokeshire
Hive Type
WBC
Number of Hives
1
Due to me doomed drone laying queen colony i am wondering if i should shake out remaining bees in front of my two nucs in the hope some of the workers will join those small colonies in nucs.
Is this a known practice?
My two nucs are a result of a weak colony that i split yesterday as introduced a new queen into one and original queen into the other. So far they appear to have settle. but a few more bees would not go a miss
Suggestions appreciated thank you
 
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Pour first syrup in combs, wait 15 minutes. When bees are full of syrup, shake them as you said.
Fat bees are better accepted to new hive.
 
Wait a few days for the new queen to get settled in and laying then do it, not too close to the hives and if possible away from the site where their hive was. Iusually shake them out about ten twenty feet away.
 
Thanks both appreciate that. I have just returned from Apiary now as wanted a wuick check to see if new queen had been extracated from her fondant cage, she had not so i removed most of fondant and replaced on comb.
Back to Drone bees. I opened up again and by jingo there are a lot of bees in this half a third are drones but a big colony of workers, all very noisy. I am still in a quandry as there are a good many decent drawn frames in this hive.
I found the queen and killed her..
I am in half a mind to buy another queen and introduce her just becasuse there are so many bees.
Is this worth while dya think. It seems a waste of bees to just let them die.
 
You could give them ONE frame with some eggs & open brood from another hive that can spare it.
Mark that frame - a coloured drawing pin stuck into the top of the topbar is conventional.
They should create at least one emergency QC on that frame.
Note the date you introduce the frame.

Having done that, please revise handling of QCs (not shaking that frame, leaving alone after emergence for long enough for mating, etc, etc).


There is a major difference between Laying Workers and a Drone Laying Queen.
LWs reject replacement Queens. (Hence shakeout is pretty inevitable.)
DLQs just need to be replaced (without undue delay) by a functional Q.


Just a bit concerned about your splitting another hive to create two weak nucs.
Much better to have built up the parent colony BEFORE splitting.
And stealing a frame with some proto-brood is going to weaken one of them even more ...
Insulate them and if remotely needed, feed 50/50 syrup.
 
Itma, your proposal is out of question. It does not work.

Sorry?

DLQ, squash her as always, and then provide test frame with eggs/open larvae? They would make emergency QC(s). And, in time, sort themselves out.
That would work.
And one could add the refinement of selecting a QC started on the youngest of larvae (culling the first-capped) QCs, but there should be no question that the colony could be saved by this method.
Sure, a ready-made new Q would be better/quicker ...

But the only immediate source of a ready-made Q seems to be one of the splits.
Combining with that would be yet another option.

Not splitting the second hive, but instead combining with the (DLQ removed) drone-brood colony would have been a better route to follow. And then, that stronger colony could have been split at some point in the (nearish) future. But that option is no longer possible.
Without seeing the situation in person, I can't say whether or not there would still be a possibility of combining all three of these poor colonies at this point.

There are several different plausible scenarios.
Without seeing the detail of the situation, I don't think anyone can say which would be best.




The important point is that "Shaking out" - as per the title of this thread - is neither a necessary nor a wise response to a Drone Laying Queen which is the situation described in the first post.
"Shaking Out" is what you do in response to a DIFFERENT situation, Laying Workers.

DLQ - remove and terminate her (she is no use any more), and then either requeen (by whatever method) or combine with a Queenright colony.
LW - shake out - they are "doomed".

Both situations give rise to a lack of worker brood and just drone brood.
They can be distinguished by the laying pattern (or not) and the presence of a Q (or not).
Quite different situations, with quite different responses.
 
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Back to Drone bees. I opened up again and by jingo there are a lot of bees in this half a third are drones but a big colony of workers, all very noisy. I am still in a quandry as there are a good many decent drawn frames in this hive.
I found the queen and killed her..
I am in half a mind to buy another queen and introduce her just becasuse there are so many bees.
Is this worth while dya think. It seems a waste of bees to just let them die.

Yes, you CAN requeen - by whatever method (emergency cells on test frame, combine, or buy in and introduce new Q).

There is no need to EITHER let an ex-DLQ colony just die out OR shake them out.
 
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Itma, the task was the most simple.

Wintered bees cannot make any more queen cells. It is almost May.

Test frame ...in drone brood hive in May.
 
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Wintered bees cannot make any more queen cells. It is almost May.

It IS almost May.
In the South of the UK, "wintered bees" are gone. (Regardless of any question of their abilities.)
Swarm season has started.

Has your snow melted yet?
 
It IS almost May.
In the South of the UK, "wintered bees" are gone. (Regardless of any question of their abilities.)
Swarm season has started.

Has your snow melted yet?
Isn't that Finman's point - with no over-wintered bees, and no new workers (as it's a DLQ), which bees are going to take care of the test frame?
 
Isn't that Finman's point - with no over-wintered bees, and no new workers (as it's a DLQ), which bees are going to take care of the test frame?

I fear it seems you too haven't read what was posted ...
... by jingo there are a lot of bees in this half a third are drones but a big colony of workers, ...
... It seems a waste of bees to just let them die.

Doesn't sound like "no winter bees and no new workers" to me.
 
that could well be the case. she may have started the year making workers.
My question was.........with so many workers i could buy a queen and be in hive by tuesday. A risk i know but surely worth a go rescuing. Only question is will enough workers survive three weeks or more to see new offspring take over.

Please someone must read the question and understand what i am saying.

"To clarify i cannot add a test frame i have no spare i have no brood no eggs
 
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Due to me doomed drone laying queen colony i am wondering if i should shake out remaining bees in front of my two nucs in the hope some of the workers will join those small colonies in nucs.
Is this a known practice?
I found a queen and killed it

I have answered to this ....drone laying queen....

Itma, when do you think that drone layer has born?
How old are those worker bees? ....
I suppose that not born this year.
 
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I fear it seems you too haven't read what was posted ...

Doesn't sound like "no winter bees and no new workers" to me.

No, sorry, I didn't. I read your post (#7) which had no reference to worker bees being present.
 
Children children please. this bickering is not answering my question
 
:rules:
I understand - but why, then, did you tell Itma that a test frame won't work - post 9?

Test frame? The owner wrote that he found a queen and killed it.

If you have drone hive, where you need test frame?

Test what?

I mean that is ridiculous to try to rear queen in this kind of hive from test frame.
It would be midd June when new workers will emerge.
 
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