Quantcast

Queenless?

Beekeeping Forum

Help Support Beekeeping Forum:

ian 

House Bee
Joined
Dec 1, 2008
Messages
348
Reaction score
0
Location
uk
Hive Type
none
Hi

It depends very much on when they have gone q-less, if the queen failed early Winter the bees you have left are liable to be old and past it, little point in risking a unite with a healthy hive.

If however the queen has started laying and then failed you may have a more viable unit with young bees that are usefull additions.

Purely depends on what you find.

Regards Ian
 

Finman 

Queen Bee
Joined
Nov 8, 2008
Messages
25,649
Reaction score
201
Location
Finland, Helsinki
Hive Type
langstroth
.
You give to it new queen,
join to another hive or
you put brood frame and bees make a new queen.
You bye a nuc, and join it to bees.
 

admin 

Queen Bee
Joined
Jul 28, 2008
Messages
6,392
Reaction score
3
Location
Hampshire uk
Hive Type
national
Number of Hives
6
Introducing a queen at winters end to an overwintered queenless colony is not as difficult as at other times of the year.

Has anyone any experience of shaking all the bees in front of the hive and allowing the new queen to walk in with them?
 

cstroud 

New Bee
Joined
Aug 21, 2009
Messages
97
Reaction score
0
Location
uk
Hive Type
national
Number of Hives
15
Hi the problem may be where to get a new queen from that early in the year- they are'nt generally available until April at the earliest, I don't know what sort of state a colony would be in by then, so uniting would probably be the better option I would have thought.

I'm hoping that we will have a good warm spring to give the bees a good start.

Chris
 

Finman 

Queen Bee
Joined
Nov 8, 2008
Messages
25,649
Reaction score
201
Location
Finland, Helsinki
Hive Type
langstroth
Introducing a queen at winters end to an overwintered queenless colony is not as difficult as at other times of the year.

Has anyone any experience of shaking all the bees in front of the hive and allowing the new queen to walk in with them?
Sping introducing is very easy. I don't remember that I have missed any queen in spring.

Shaking bees does not help in queen issue. It is hazard job.

This is one of the best inroduging method, pic. You press a little mesh cage against comb and there is a queen and some workers. Put there some honey to eat.

Then let it be 24 hours. If ouside workers do not bite the mesh, they have accepted the queen




'
 

Hombre 

Queen Bee
Joined
Feb 27, 2009
Messages
2,818
Reaction score
1
Location
West Midlands
Hive Type
14x12
Number of Hives
Ten
What can be done with queenless colonies in spring? Should they be destroyed or can they be united
Shake the bees in front of another hive to let them seek sanctuary and bolster that colony.

Lack of numbers alone shouldn't be a death sentence. :)

One of the benefits of not running a single colony,
 

oliver90owner 

Queen Bee
Joined
Jul 15, 2009
Messages
15,643
Reaction score
49
Location
Lincolnshire
Hive Type
14x12
Yep, certainly unite if possible. That way you have a chance of an early split to regain the status quo, if that is important to you.

Regards, RAB
 

sherwood 

House Bee
Joined
Mar 19, 2009
Messages
309
Reaction score
1
Location
herts/bucks/midx border
Hive Type
commercial
Number of Hives
20+National,commercial langstroth
As previously stated it may be best not to unite unless you know why the queen failed. If there is disease present you may well be moving it to another healthy colony. Equally well it is not worth pinching some eggs from another colony in the hope of rearing a queen as there are no drones to fertilise a princess.

The best option maybe therefore to unite them with another weakish colony and treat them to a feed with some Fumidil B in it as a precaution against Nosema.

If you had an overwintered Nuc that maybe the ideal colony to join them with.
 

thurrock bees 

Drone Bee
Joined
Aug 1, 2009
Messages
1,084
Reaction score
0
Location
Haywards Heath, Sussex
Hive Type
national
Number of Hives
27
just a thought/brain wave...... remove a good queen from another hive , allow that hive to make a queen cell as they have enough nurse bees. then put the good queen in the q less hive????

dont have a pop at me, just a idea?? your thoughts???


im thinking about the lack of nurse bees in the q less hive?:grouphug:
 

Bcrazy 

Drone Bee
Joined
Nov 14, 2008
Messages
1,491
Reaction score
5
Location
Warboys, CAMBS
Hive Type
none
Number of Hives
nil bees given away all colonies
Hi thurrock bees

Nice idea but where are the drones to mate with the new queen?

Regards;
 

sherwood 

House Bee
Joined
Mar 19, 2009
Messages
309
Reaction score
1
Location
herts/bucks/midx border
Hive Type
commercial
Number of Hives
20+National,commercial langstroth
just a thought/brain wave...... remove a good queen from another hive , allow that hive to make a queen cell as they have enough nurse bees. then put the good queen in the q less hive????

dont have a pop at me, just a idea?? your thoughts???


im thinking about the lack of nurse bees in the q less hive?:grouphug:
Thurrock where exactly are these phantom drones that are going to fertilise this queen you are hoping they will create.
 
Joined
Jun 9, 2009
Messages
1,065
Reaction score
0
Location
Kirkbymoorside, North Yorkshire.
Hive Type
national
Number of Hives
9
Shake the bees in front of another hive to let them seek sanctuary and bolster that colony.

Lack of numbers alone shouldn't be a death sentence. :)

One of the benefits of not running a single colony,
A 2nd colony wasn't an option for me last year, however there are plenty of other beeks in the area that may welcome the extra bees if my colony should prove queenless. I think the important thing is to learn why the colony became queenless. If it was my mistake then I would have made the same mistake with 2 colonies.

I think the best option, in early spring, is to unite as soon as queenlessness is evident.
 

Poly Hive 

Queen Bee
Joined
Dec 4, 2008
Messages
13,655
Reaction score
3
Location
Scottish Borders
Hive Type
national
Number of Hives
9 and 18 Nucs
FWIW.

It's unlikely that beekeeper error makes for a queenless hive in spring.

Most poor doers in spring are drone layers.

Easiest cure is shaking off in front of a good colony. EVERY colony in spring can benefit from a boost in numbers as numbers (lack of) hold back progress. Think warmth.

Diease. Yes I know this is pushed and pushed but a queenless/dronelaying colony is not a direct symptom of disease. It's pushed as part of the education project and whilst in theory it is always possible that any colony has a disease issue the probability is that it is not.

Unless of course there is a known outbreak.

2nd year queens have a higher chance of failing but not as high as 3d years or for that matter 4th year queens. And if my 4th year pegged out before I could breed from her I would be mightly peeved. ;)

PH
 

oliver90owner 

Queen Bee
Joined
Jul 15, 2009
Messages
15,643
Reaction score
49
Location
Lincolnshire
Hive Type
14x12
Am I missing something here? You think that your single colony is queenless? If so, why do you think that? We are not yet into February, so there may be many colonies with little or no brood at all, and the weather has not exactly been conducive to checking (not in Lincolnshire, anyway). Or are we talking theory here not experience.

A 2nd colony wasn't an option for me last year I have always thought you would never have had a second colony (as a starter beek) even if someone paid you (from your posts and experienced advice to new starters). Is this the first signs of a change of mind? One does get nervous about things like this with just the one colony.

I had to check out a colony in mid-February last year after finding no brood on a quick inspection. The queen was there and started laying sometime in the next month. If it had not been so warm I would not have even peeped in initially, let alone go back in and seach for the queen, for possibly another month or 6 weeks. Peace of mind, with multiple colonies, is definitely worth the effort of mananging two (or more) colonies when starting out.

Regards, RAB
 
Joined
Jun 9, 2009
Messages
1,065
Reaction score
0
Location
Kirkbymoorside, North Yorkshire.
Hive Type
national
Number of Hives
9
I have no reason to think my colony is queenless. The bees were in a nice tight cluster and behaved okay when I did the OA at the end of December. Also the cappings on the monitor tray were in a nice round pattern.

I will not change my mind regarding starting with more than 1 colony. What I am hoping to do is prove that if I can successfully get 1 colony through winter then I can do it with 2.

Of course I'm nervous about loosing my colony isn't everybody, or is it a game of numbers where beeks are happy to have many colonies and accept a percentage of losses?
 

Poly Hive 

Queen Bee
Joined
Dec 4, 2008
Messages
13,655
Reaction score
3
Location
Scottish Borders
Hive Type
national
Number of Hives
9 and 18 Nucs
two colonies are always better than one for many reasons.

I too was under the impression that you thought you were Queenelss and also wondered how you had come to that conclusion.

So as far as you kow all is well, leave them be for a few weeks yet and if you must, and most beginners cannot help themselves, then pull one frame and see if there is brood.

As for a numbers game then assuredly yes it is. I accept I will lose a percentage each year, three so far that I know of, and it has always been that way for me, and I suggest for most who keep more than a handful. The trick is to keep the percentage down.

To think that 100% wintering is always possible is a bit of a dream.

PH
 

cstroud 

New Bee
Joined
Aug 21, 2009
Messages
97
Reaction score
0
Location
uk
Hive Type
national
Number of Hives
15
Hi,
the old bee keeper who taught me reminds me constantly not to open the hives (for a proper inspection) before the temperature is at least 15C. I think this is worth all new beekeepers remembering. I have been guilty of being too hasty on many occasions, but you will sacrifice your brood if its gets 'chilled'.

by all means look for the queen but be careful. I have two weak hives which I plan to unite, not really sure if either are queenless, but I won't know until it is much warmer- but I suppose I have the benefit of having other colonies to split later.

Chris
 

admin 

Queen Bee
Joined
Jul 28, 2008
Messages
6,392
Reaction score
3
Location
Hampshire uk
Hive Type
national
Number of Hives
6
In my opinion the biggest killer of bees = STRESS.
Open a hive to early and it puts immense stress on them.

To much stress and they cant fight off a virus or parasite's.
 
Top