overwintering an supers

[seaninis]

good evening.. bit of help please. the weather is turning now (up in sunny highlands!!), i have two hives both have supers on with honey on. do i leave these supers on to let the bees take the honey whilst also putting on a crown board and feeder on top?? thanks Sean

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

How many supers on each hive? how full? bit late to be taking supers off now then feeding to replace the honey you've filched. A full super on each hive would be ample for them to overwinter on (we're assuming, as you haven't fiddled around much in the brood there's honey there as well) Just take the queen excluder off and leave them to it.

 

[Magwat]

If I was in your location this late in the season I would just remove the queen excluder and leave the super (assuming only one on the hive), put some insulation under the roof on top of the crownboard and leave them to settle for the winter.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Yep....just take the excluder off and insulate. If you don't want to run brood and a half you can sort it in the spring

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

..... and before anyone suggests it, I think it's a bit late to think of nadiring the shallows (putting them under the brood)

 

[REDWOOD]

you could take the honey off and feed a block of fondant

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

if there's ivy around there it might not be all that pleasant.

 

[user 6228]

How many supers on each hive? how full? bit late to be taking supers off now then feeding to replace the honey you've filched. A full super on each hive would be ample for them to overwinter on (we're assuming, as you haven't fiddled around much in the brood there's honey there as well) Just take the queen excluder off and leave them to it.

More I study the heat flow inside hives the more complex it appears, so I wouldnt dont take any persons word that they really understand what is going on with the thermal interaction of honey, comb, cavity, enclosure. So as JMB implies, its best to leave it to the real experts, the honeybees.

 

[REDWOOD]

And there's me thinking that you were second to none [emoji219]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Teemore]

Before you go taking of fthe queen excluder, can I just query whether you have used drone or worker foundation/comb in the supers?
If you have drone comb in the supers then you will have the colony move upwards into the supers over the course of the winter and when they start to brood, the queen may then be laying into drone comb with predictable results.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Good point - another good reason not to use drone foundation in supers.

 

[Hedgerow Honey]

As I found out in the spring what I thought was two supers of worker was in fact drone I had left on in the winter. On the flip side I moved the hive to my mating apiary to flood the area with drones.

I did notice that when the drones hatched the cells were filled remarkably quickly.

 

[Millet]

..... and before anyone suggests it, I think it's a bit late to think of nadiring the shallows (putting them under the brood)

I did just that today which i was 50/50 in doing, however they where taking tymol syrup last week which will not be capped a presume but they have stopped now (today), i done the same last year but it was a bit earlier with the Nadir, this year they are two weeks further forward for some reason, i will find out in spring if i have goofed it or not.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Not good practice to nadir a super if it's full with ripened stores - not even earlier on. Bee like to have the stores above and behind the brood nest and it's a lot of work for them to rearrange things, especially late on in the year. If you nadir early, the bees move downwards as the brood nest contracts putting stores at the top as brood emerges.
Saving grace this year I suppose is that bees have been brooding a lot later so should have some space above to move stores into.

 

[Millet]

Not good practice to nadir a super if it's full with ripened stores - not even earlier on. Bee like to have the stores above and behind the brood nest and it's a lot of work for them to rearrange things, especially late on in the year. If you nadir early, the bees move downwards as the brood nest contracts putting stores at the top as brood emerges.
Saving grace this year I suppose is that bees have been bringing a lot later so should have some space above to move stores into.

That is why i was 50/50 on doing it, i was going to leave them alone but it was a nice day with plenty of activity so i went for it, on a good note they where very calm.

 

[Erichalfbee]

I must admit the only time I've nadired supers is after harvest and before feeding and then only uncapped honey. It's usually been moved in a couple of days

 

[Millet]

I must admit the only time I've nadired supers is after harvest and before feeding and then only uncapped honey. It's usually been moved in a couple of days

There sure is a lot of mixed information on here through the years, and to be honest i'm really sick i done what i did today, i would have much rather left them alone, i know what i will be doing next year if i have not killed them.

Frig this Nadir lark.

 

[masterBK]

Although in the natural order of things bees move upwards onto the stores as the winter progresses they are quite capable of going downwards or any direction required. I run double brood colonies and many often go into winter with far more stores in the bottom box than in the upper one. Nearly all will be in the top box in spring and will have eaten the stores in the bottom box . I haven't lost a colony from starvation in decades as virtualy all my losses (generally no more than one or two colonies a year at most and I run between 27 and 30 colonies most years) are from drone layers (usually from late supersedure and queen not getting mated or failing queens not forgetting the laying workers. Also if I have to unite a weak colony in spring I count that as a loss.

 

[Millet]

Although in the natural order of things bees move upwards onto the stores as the winter progresses they are quite capable of going downwards or any direction required. I run double brood colonies and many often go into winter with far more stores in the bottom box than in the upper one. Nearly all will be in the top box in spring and will have eaten the stores in the bottom box . I haven't lost a colony from starvation in decades as virtualy all my losses (generally no more than one or two colonies a year at most and I run between 27 and 30 colonies most years) are from drone layers (usually from late supersedure and queen not getting mated or failing queens not forgetting the laying workers. Also if I have to unite a weak colony in spring I count that as a loss.

Thank you for that, even though i may be hijacking this thread you have stopped the palpitations for the time being.

 

[Gilberdyke John]

There sure is a lot of mixed information on here through the years, and to be honest i'm really sick i done what i did today, i would have much rather left them alone, i know what i will be doing next year if i have not killed them.

Frig this Nadir lark.

It's a hackneyed phrase but ask two beekeepers the same question and you get three (sometimes more) answers. it's time to apply a healthy dose of cynicism and use logic in your decision process.
Your bees will probably cope but I'd suggest next year you remove the qe plus arrange the boxes after harvesting and before feeding. Then leave them to seal the joints and any cracks or crannies ready for winter. Restrict your checking to weight of the hive unless there's some very good reason to do otherwise. If you leave the super on top the worst that can happen is the queen lays in it and you have to do some sorting out in spring.