Number of frames for super?

[mike99]

Hi. I have just added my first super to my new colony that I got on Saturday. I haven't used the QE yet as they need to draw comb as the frames all have foundation and I don't want to discourage them heading up.
I have a dummy board in my BB to give me working room but do I use 11 frames or 12 in the super?

 

[boywonder]

Personally, I always use 12 (on the basis of "why wouldn't you get as many frames drawn / filled as possible"), but it is a question I have often wondered myself, so am interested in the other replies you get. My frames are Hoffman SN4s, so the spacing is AOK.

I subsequently move them onto 10 frame castellations (which I know is a bit perverse, using Hoffman frames on castellations) - so they get drawn deeper.

 

[Beefriendly]

Hi. I have just added my first super to my new colony that I got on Saturday. I haven't used the QE

Your queen will most likely lay in the super as soon as it is drawn ....if you don't add a QE.
Stick one on and make sure she is below, it is no detriment to them drawing out super foundation.
Start with 11 is the usual advice. You'll notice they will draw the center frames first, when these are nearly fully drawn you can, if you wish, move them to outer edges and replace them with the undrawn edge frames.

 

[Ian123]

Hi mike I am happy to leave qx off to encourage them up onto foundation. Even if the queen lays up there just find her and drop back down and slip qx in on next visit no harm done, unless your doing cut comb of course. Even then I’ve sacrificed one and dropped it into brood box and on next visit put it back. You can spin those frames that have had brood in till there dry��in regards to your question it will depend on your frames/metal spacers, fit the frames in the box and you should have your answer but 11 or 12 it will make little odds. As bf says shuffle the frames as they draw. Ian

 

[Poly Hive]

I work for cut comb all the time so am always giving supers of foundation and yes they to over the QE. The bees will draw it out no bother when the conditions are right.

By letting your queen have free reign you are setting yourself up for that worst of all situations, brood and a half but that is your call.

PH

 

[Erichalfbee]

Draw on Hoffman and move to 10 space

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

why are people so obsessed that bees won't cross a queen excluder? never seen that mythic al problem - they won't waste their time going up until they need to - drawn comb or foundation.
Should only be a maximum of 11 frames in a box anyway - deep or shallow - trying to jam a twelfth in is silly and you'll end up regretting it.
As for supers - I like ten frames in each but unless there's a really good flow on, you risk the bees getting creative with the extra space if you put ten in with only foundation, either start with eleven or alternate each frame of foundation with drawn comb.

 

[Curly green fingers]

why are people so obsessed that bees won't cross a queen excluder? never seen that mythic al problem - they won't waste their time going up until they need to - drawn comb or foundation.
Should only be a maximum of 11 frames in a box anyway - deep or shallow - trying to jam a twelfth in is silly and you'll end up regretting it.
As for supers - I like ten frames in each but unless there's a really good flow on, you risk the bees getting creative with the extra space if you put ten in with only foundation, either start with eleven or alternate each frame of foundation with drawn comb.

Why will you regret putting 12 frames in I've started on 12 frames and as they've drawn them out I've taken 1 out I use self spacing frames I've not had any probs .
Infact I've not had so much brase comb..

 

[Poly Hive]

No doubt but.... your frames are new yes? So no propolis to make an odds.

Manleys in supers are so much better whether going for CC or not they are just a simpler management method. No coincidence the inventor was working a fair number of colonies.

PH

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Why will you regret putting 12 frames.

because everything is jammed in tight, then the bees start propolising, you have to lever out the first frame, lugs get broken, bees get wound up, then you have to jam that frame back in again - bees get wound up, queen gets killed.
Same goes for Manley frames - apart from the queen bit. Good idea way back when but now belongs to the domain of dinosaurs.

 

[Poly Hive]

Dinosaurs? You are joking surely.

They don't get stuck and are ideal for CC production and for extracting honey too up to and including Heather.

Tosh.

PH

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Your opinion - and we all know what that is worth.
Tosh

 

[Poly Hive]

LOL.

Check the mirror matey.

PH

 

[Swarm]

I've had to use a super of Manleys this year due to desperation. They do get stuck together, it's the reason I've not used them for years. This year it's any port in a storm.

 

[Beefriendly]

I've had to use a super of Manleys this year due to desperation. They do get stuck together, it's the reason I've not used them for years. This year it's any port in a storm.

I've got 10+ supers full of them stacked outside many fully drawn and saved for the heather.....then the bonfire....unless any one wants to collect them October time. They are buggers to get out when the bees propolise them together and even worse when they get damp and the wood expands slightly. I've broken several levering them out.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Yep. Manleys do get stuck for me too. I hate them. I have all my super frames made up and might just get away with what I have. There are ten Manleys on the shelf just in case.

 

[Swarm]

These ten frames came out in one block
I am just on a tea break from making up frames, I can make twenty eight super frames so one super will end up dummied to eight. Moving on to deep frames now because I'm out of shallows.

 

[Curly green fingers]

Can we differentiate the different frames pls Manley's have straight sides. The lugs and side bars are the same . Hoffman's ?

 

[Beefriendly]

Manley's self space at 10 per super. Some manage to cram 12 brand new hoffmans into the same space.

 

[Hivemaker.]

Manley frames are not suitable here, but being propolised together is just a minor annoyance compared to the other reasons.