New bee keeper

[Bee_Careful]

Hello all,
Got my first colony at the weekend from someone in the local BKA and we transferred them to my hive. Gave them some feed yesterday and they seem nice and calm and starting to forage around .

Just a quick Q: where can I download some hive record sheets? I know I could make my own but I'd probably make an a**e of it.

 

[Repwoc]

The top result is the BBKA one, some others also listed:

https://www.google.co.uk/search?sou........0....1..gws-wiz.....0..0i131.8UlO42dqV7w

 

[B+.]

The top result is the BBKA one, some others also listed:

I've seen a fair number of record card formats in my time. The interesting thing is that some score out of 4 and others out of 5. Now, I'm sure we could have a long discussion about which is more rational/easier to use but, IMHO, it seems more intuitive to say that x is half of y which is half of z (in other words, scored out of 4). This is also the way it is described in the Coloss/JAR articles on selective breeding

 

[Beefriendly]

The interesting thing is that some score out of 4 and others out of 5.

But what are you scoring for?
Seeing the queen is binary, yes or no answer. Seeing eggs is binary, Yes no. Frames of brood; if counted can be from 0 to 18+.

As per a previous posts my record sheets are along the lines of....
Headed sheet stating Apiary Site, queen history, year of birth colour/clipped.
General notes for inspections...
1. Reason for inspection
2. Queen seen/not seen
3. Eggs seen/not seen
4. Brood seen/can be yes/no or count frames.
5. Queen cells, Yes no.
6 Weather.
7. Temper.
.8. Notes.
You can also include hive configuration so you know how many brood boxes and supers you have on.

 

[B+.]

But what are you scoring for?
Seeing the queen is binary, yes or no answer. Seeing eggs is binary, Yes no. Frames of brood; if counted can be from 0 to 18+.

As per a previous posts my record sheets are along the lines of....
Headed sheet stating Apiary Site, queen history, year of birth colour/clipped.
General notes for inspections...
1. Reason for inspection
2. Queen seen/not seen
3. Eggs seen/not seen
4. Brood seen/can be yes/no or count frames.
5. Queen cells, Yes no.
6 Weather.
7. Temper.
.8. Notes.
You can also include hive configuration so you know how many brood boxes and supers you have on.

Most of those things are incidental (queen/eggs seen/not seen) and others are outside of our control (weather, etc). I am scoring: any sign of aggression, stability on the comb, swarming intention, signs of disease, honey production, etc). This is all documented in a JAR (Journal of Apicultural Research)/ Coloss piece I have referenced before.
The point is, the tests should be consistent so that the results are comparable. To illustrate this, LASI (Laboratory of Social Insects) claimed to have "hygienic" bees for sale. However, the testing that they did was not consistent with the recognised approach (they allowed twice the recommended time) so their results were not comparable with other researchers.

 

[Beefriendly]

I am scoring: any sign of aggression, stability on the comb, swarming intention, signs of disease, honey production, etc). This is all documented in a JAR (Journal of Apicultural Research)/ Coloss piece I have referenced before..

And you think that type of record keeping is suitable for a beginner who has just got his first hive????
LOL....

 

[B+.]

And you think that type of record keeping is suitable for a beginner who has just got his first hive????
LOL....

Since the OP asked about record cards, I though it was relevant to talk about scoring too. He may not want the sophistication I spoke of but the point I was trying to make was that a 4 point system is more intuitive than a 5 point scale.
i.e. a half or a quarter are much easier to visualize than a fifth.

 

[Madge]

... a 4 point system is more intuitive than a 5 point scale.

i.e. a half or a quarter are much easier to visualize than a fifth.

Why are halves and quarters important?

How do you score for, say aggression or docility?

I use 5 points - so, 3 is a convenient medium between good and bad.

 

[Beefriendly]

the 4 points is something to do with objects, we humans can almost instantly count and memorise 4, but add a fifth and it goes **** up...
Apparently the same for bees trained to food with a number of objects...
Makes you wonder who's keeping who....

 

[B+.]

Why are halves and quarters important?

How do you score for, say aggression or docility?

I use 5 points - so, 3 is a convenient medium between good and bad.

Interesting: you defined it as good and bad (i.e. polar opposites as Beefriendly said earlier). In fact, you need to know how good or how bad. Then look to make improvement through careful breeding.

The scale for gentleness is:
4 points - No use of smoke and no protective clothes are necessary to avoid stings during normal working procedures.
3 points - The colony can easily be worked without stings, if using some smoke.
2 points - Single bees attack and sting during working procedure, even if smoke is used intensively.
1 point - In spite of the use of smoke, the colony shows a strong defensive reaction on being handled, or bees attack without being disturbed.

I am reluctant to ever give a colony full marks as there can always be some improvement. I would give a really good colony 3.9 or 3.8. Sometimes, the difference in two full-sister colonies can be very small but, over a series of inspections, the average of the scores from each inspection will usually be slightly different, sometimes significantly so.

This is getting a bit more in depth than the usual beginner posts though

 

[birdsandbees]

I started out relying on my memory, this was okay for a few hives but as the numbers grew I tried record sheets, keeping them on a clipboard wasn't practical, I then kept them under the roof but they'd get wet or the wind would blow them off somewhere when I opened up.

Perhaps not scientific but these days I have a laminated A4 sheet with the top info for each hive.
Queen type (eg: home bred amm or supplier name and type)
Year
Mated
Marked
Clipped
Other note

I then just use a dry wipe pen to write down the date of inspection and notes for reference, just a couple of lines to refresh my memory.

something that could read...

16/06/19 Not opened brood (if for example they are awaiting a queen to mate from a Virgin noted on last visit) added Super, temper good, weather poor, raining.

(Date) Queen not seen but eggs and BIAS all looks good - temper good, weather good.

(Date) Cups seen, not charged, Queen present and laying, have room but add Super next, temper good

As I said it's not scientific but something I can refer to, so on the next inspection I can see what I may need to do.

I can use both sides, easily change the info for the queen if anything changes and wipe it clear to start again the following season if needed.

I'm not saying it's a great idea, just something that works for me as all I need to worry about is keeping the pen in my breast pocket and a cloth in my toolbox.

 

[Eyeman]

Interesting: you defined it as good and bad (i.e. polar opposites as Beefriendly said earlier). In fact, you need to know how good or how bad. Then look to make improvement through careful breeding.

The scale for gentleness is:
4 points - No use of smoke and no protective clothes are necessary to avoid stings during normal working procedures.
3 points - The colony can easily be worked without stings, if using some smoke.
2 points - Single bees attack and sting during working procedure, even if smoke is used intensively.
1 point - In spite of the use of smoke, the colony shows a strong defensive reaction on being handled, or bees attack without being disturbed.

I am reluctant to ever give a colony full marks as there can always be some improvement. I would give a really good colony 3.9 or 3.8. Sometimes, the difference in two full-sister colonies can be very small but, over a series of inspections, the average of the scores from each inspection will usually be slightly different, sometimes significantly so.

This is getting a bit more in depth than the usual beginner posts though

Don't forget to randomise your inpections and change bees suit and gloves if colony scores 2 with a sting as it will affect the behaviour of the next colony's inspection.

 

[Bee_Careful]

Wow, didn't expect to open such a can of worms with my simple question but thanks for all the comments.

What was that about N beekeepers and N+1 answers?...

 

[B+.]

Wow, didn't expect to open such a can of worms with my simple question but thanks for all the comments.

There is a rule in beekeeping: ask any question of N beekeepers and you will receive N+1 answers (at least). ;-)

just incase anyone didn't know.

 

[eltalia]

Wow, didn't expect to open such a can of worms with my simple question but thanks for all the comments.

What was that about N beekeepers and N+1 answers?...

The thread is 'teaching' you about KISS..like
The Good
The Bad
The Ugly

...right there is your record template.
Choose a colour for each and affix above the entrance as a disc.

Bill

 

[Bee_Careful]

Wow, didn't expect to open such a can of worms with my simple question but thanks for all the comments.

What was that about N beekeepers and N+1 answers?...

There is a rule in beekeeping: ask any question of N beekeepers and you will receive N+1 answers (at least). ;-).

It was a rhetorical question, but I think I've just experienced it first hand.

 

[Beefriendly]

It was a rhetorical question, but I think I've just experienced it first hand.

Nah....currently its n=n
n=n +1 is yet to appear...but sit tight it will be along shortly.

 

[Bee_Careful]

Nah....currently its n=n
n=n +1 is yet to appear...but sit tight it will be along shortly.

As long as it doesn't become N^n