Mating flight?

[Jonnyl]

Hope you all can help me please. A two hive apiary i have which has vexed me most of this year. Hive 1, overwintered queen, first summer. Built up very well and perhaps i never got the supers on early enough, built swarm cells. Queen nuked and 1 cell left. All good. But then bees swarm? Missed a cell? Went to collect them from where i saw them gathering 100 yards away but when i got there they were gone. Vanished. Returned to the hive, double brood and two supers tall, and 1000s bearding the full height of the hive. Fanning. Had to be a mating flight yes? But for all the world this was a swarm. Ive only been a beek for 5 years but ive raised several queens and have never witnessed this display before. Went into the hive to check the cell was open but there it was intact. Closed up even more baffled. Two days later the same again. Haven't went back in the hive again but the traffic is indicative of a thriving hive. Thoughts?
Hive 2. 3rd year queen, delightful lady, best ive had and have bred ½ a dozen qieens from her, all good. Slow to get going this year but they're there now, 2 supers full. Was going to retire her this summer to a nuc and maybe breed from her again. Anyway, my mind is made up as i find a dozen or more sealed cells. Thought she's gone but wait, there she is, pkain as day. Moved her as planned and closed up. Why would she still be there? Thank you all for any input.

 

[Boston Bees]

my mind is made up as i find a dozen or more sealed cells. Thought she's gone but wait, there she is, pkain as day. Moved her as planned and closed up. Why would she still be there? Thank you all for any input.

The cells may only just have been capped. There's nothing to say that the queen has to lead her swarm away the moment the cells are capped. Sometimes they do, sometimes they don't.

 

[madasafish]

Maybe the weather was not good enough for a hive to swarm?
Basically I believe bees need a warm dry day to swarm: and that (usually) means warm and dry near midday.

 

[Finman]

Swarm is gone. Nothing can be done.

 

[Jonnyl]

The cells may only just have been capped. There's nothing to say that the queen has to lead her swarm away the moment the cells are capped. Sometimes they do, sometimes they don't.

Yes and self evident. Must admit that i didn't that was the case. Her waiting around would probably mean certain death for her though?

 

[Jonnyl]

Maybe the weather was not good enough for a hive to swarm?
Basically I believe bees need a warm dry day to swarm: and that (usually) means warm and dry near midday.

The weather had beed iffy. Thats why i was caught out.

 

[Jonnyl]

Swarm is gone. Nothing can be done.

But it didn't Finman. I could see the small cluster i though was the swarm and had my eye on it most of the time. These bees went back to hive and started fanning her home. 30 mins later i saw them all march in. That was a mating flight. Same thing two days later.

 

[Boston Bees]

Yes and self evident. Must admit that i didn't that was the case. Her waiting around would probably mean certain death for her though?

I said she didn't have to leave as soon as the cell was capped. There are still 8 days further until the new virgin emerges, and even then the nurse bees can delay emergence if the swarm hasn't had a chance to leave because of bad weather for example.

 

[Finman]

But it didn't Finman. I could see the small cluster i though was the swarm and had my eye on it most of the time. These bees went back to hive and started fanning her home. 30 mins later i saw them all march in. That was a mating flight. Same thing two days later.

Sounds like daily cleansing flight, when bees come out to empty their gut.

 

[Antipodes]

Sounds like daily cleansing flight, when bees come out to empty their gut.

Not if they clustered.

 

[Finman]

Not if they clustered.

I have never seen clustered mating flight.
I have reared 55 years queen and mated them.

I know that queens make several mating flights in a day and during 1-3 days .

I have looked into mating nucs many times and there is no queen there. But no clusters wating her to return.

The queen can return into its hive without quidance. What heck she do in the cluster which is clustered onto a bush.
The queen localize its hive begore she goes to mate.

 

[Erichalfbee]

The queen won't be in the cluster. But the bees can still cluster outside.
I've shown my video many times. Happy to show it again

 

[Finman]

The queen won't be in the cluster. But the bees can still cluster outside.
I've shown my video many times. Happy to show it again

How many times you have seen such mating clustering in your life?

I saw from internet, that I have debated about this thing in this forum 10 years ago.
Let it be so.

 

[Jonnyl]

Sounds like daily cleansing flight, when bees come out to empty their gut.

With respect Finman, this was no cleansing/orientation flight, this looked like a swarm for all the world. Except it wasn't. I hadn't read, let alone witnessed, a mating flight could appear to be like a swarm and was asking others if they ever had. Thanks

 

[Finman]

With respect Finman, this was no cleansing/orientation flight, this looked like a swarm for all the world. Except it wasn't. I hadn't read, let alone witnessed, a mating flight could appear to be like a swarm and was asking others if they ever had. Thanks

Swarms I have seen hunreds

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I hadn't read, let alone witnessed, a mating flight could appear to be like a swarm

Plenty of information to be found on here - a few of us have witnessed them over the years, Dani managed to video one.
Big difference between an open mind and an open mouth (as you can see )

 

[Fritillary]

How many times you have seen such mating clustering in your life?

Twice. Where the queen was I can't tell you, but certainly have seen a substantial cloud of bees fly out like a swarm, hang in a nearby bush for a while and return home at time of mating, not swarming as we think of it.

 

[Finman]

I wonder, why mating swarm is not a routine habit in queen mating. Only blessed beekeepers can see it.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I wonder, why mating swarm is not a routine habit in queen mating. Only blessed beekeepers can see it.

or maybe only the damned can't

 

[Fritillary]

Certainly am not feeling a blessed beekeeper in any other way!
But if every time you see an odd looking skinny orange dog thing outside you just think, well that's a very peculiar looking and sounding dog, you're going to be a long time seeing a fox...