Lots of dead bees on OMF

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Don’t ask anybody who is not familiar with the disease to give you an opinion. Have the beekeepers from your teaching Apiary ever seen CBPV?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Getting more and more confused and worried!

Should I be giving them a second chance and waiting to see if they can recover, or are the risks too great to the other healthy hive. I contacted my local teaching apiary, they asked if it could be poisoning. If it was that, surely the other healthy hive would be affected too.

From the pictures that I posted, are the experienced forum members fairly certain that it is CBPV? I don't want to get it wrong as I haven't had an experienced keeper look at the colony.

I had CBPV in one hive in one apiary a few years ago - for a few weeks the deaths were catastrophic but with regular cleaning out and feeding they pulled through, had to requeen eventually though as she just about laying enoiugh to keep the colony viable.
Strangely enough the first reports of a study the BFA are doing on the disease were published in this month's magazine, early days yet but there are some telling indicators.
Seems my grandfather may have been right about imports.

 

[pargyle]

I had CBPV in one hive in one apiary a few years ago - for a few weeks the deaths were catastrophic but with regular cleaning out and feeding they pulled through, had to requeen eventually though as she just about laying enoiugh to keep the colony viable.
Strangely enough the first reports of a study the BFA are doing on the disease were published in this month's magazine, early days yet but there are some telling indicators.
Seems my grandfather may have been right about imports.

The overriding question is ... keep or kill ?

Is it worth the effort or risk of trying to pull two colonies through that are already split and depleted and clearly diseased ? .. One is queenless and potentially doomed if there are no fresh bees ..

There's time to get another decent colony going before winter and with what she has at present she could end up with just the swarm which, at present, has little provenance.

For a new beekeeper to nurse a sick hive back is a big ask. I'm rarely in favour of giving up on a colony - I've lost track of the lost causes I've kept in my life and you do get emotionally attached to things sometimes that you should really let go - but there comes a point where you need to make a decision.

Like I said .. Kill them or keep them ?

 

[E&MBees]

The overriding question is ... keep or kill ?

Is it worth the effort or risk of trying to pull two colonies through that are already split and depleted and clearly diseased ? .. One is queenless and potentially doomed if there are no fresh bees ..

There's time to get another decent colony going before winter and with what she has at present she could end up with just the swarm which, at present, has little provenance.

For a new beekeeper to nurse a sick hive back is a big ask. I'm rarely in favour of giving up on a colony - I've lost track of the lost causes I've kept in my life and you do get emotionally attached to things sometimes that you should really let go - but there comes a point where you need to make a decision.

Like I said .. Kill them or keep them ?

The keep or kill question is one that I keep chewing over, day and night.

If I were to kill, how quickly can I bring in new bees once I have cleaned and sterilised the hive and brought new wax etc? Do I need a period of quarantine to make sure that the bees with CBPV have gone.

So many ifs and buts...

 

[pargyle]

The keep or kill question is one that I keep chewing over, day and night.

If I were to kill, how quickly can I bring in new bees once I have cleaned and sterilised the hive and brought new wax etc? Do I need a period of quarantine to make sure that the bees with CBPV have gone.

So many ifs and buts...

CBPV is principally a bee to bee transmitted virus - they can also become infected from contact with infected been faeces.

As long as you clean and sterlise the hive I can't see any problem putting it back into use as soon as it has dried. Cillit Bang (which I've banned for use in the house as it is such a vile product) is one of the best things for cleaning poly boxes, bleach based with surfactants it will clean and kill bacteria - but rinse well with clean water and let it air dry afterwards.

Timber hives - usual flame treatment will sort them out and back into use.

Beekeeping is always about decisions - I spend more time considering and worrying than I do actually doing things .. what between that and making new kit and maintaing old kit there is often less time actually spent beekeeping !

 

[E&MBees]

CBPV is principally a bee to bee transmitted virus - they can also become infected from contact with infected been faeces.

As long as you clean and sterlise the hive I can't see any problem putting it back into use as soon as it has dried. Cillit Bang (which I've banned for use in the house as it is such a vile product) is one of the best things for cleaning poly boxes, bleach based with surfactants it will clean and kill bacteria - but rinse well with clean water and let it air dry afterwards.

Timber hives - usual flame treatment will sort them out and back into use.

Beekeeping is always about decisions - I spend more time considering and worrying than I do actually doing things .. what between that and making new kit and maintaing old kit there is often less time actually spent beekeeping !

Thanks. I think I’ve decided what to do.

I have read that our native black bees may have more resistance to CBPV as well as other illnesses. Do you know of any keepers that sell black bees?

 

[pargyle]

Thanks. I think I’ve decided what to do.

I have read that our native black bees may have more resistance to CBPV as well as other illnesses. Do you know of any keepers that sell black bees?

There are quite a few .. Google AMM Nucleus for sale. I've only every bought queens so I don't have any recommendations - someone on here will have some reommendations I would imagine. Always take care when buying bees to look for a trusted seller - there are some out there that you should not touch with a bargepole.

 

[Swarm]

Thanks. I think I’ve decided what to do.

I have read that our native black bees may have more resistance to CBPV as well as other illnesses. Do you know of any keepers that sell black bees?

I wouldn't just rely on a search, you don't know what you are getting, there are excellent native bee examples in West Wales but probably a long way to travel.
You could try a queen and make a nuc from your black colony but best done next year.
I've a few ideas, I'll get back to you.

 

[Swarm]

Hello Emily,
OK, I went to the apiary today where I have an Amm queen on Demarree. She produces gorgeous bees, very gentle and has been donating brood for some new queens since 2018. They were very busy today and lots of bees so I split away a nuc with a sealed cell from the top box and added a good few shakes of extra nurse bees.
Let's see what happens there, if she turns out as nice as Mam you will love them.
Failing that, my friend has also done much the same so hopefully we can sort you out, albeit not immediately.
I'll send you a pm with a bit more detail.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Hello Emily,
OK, I went to the apiary today where I have an Amm queen on Demarree. She produces gorgeous bees, very gentle and has been donating brood for some new queens since 2018. They were very busy today and lots of bees so I split away a nuc with a sealed cell from the top box and added a good few shakes of extra nurse bees.
Let's see what happens there, if she turns out as nice as Mam you will love them.
Failing that, my friend has also done much the same so hopefully we can sort you out, albeit not immediately.
I'll send you a pm with a bit more detail.

Steve that is a wonderful gesture. I hope she comes good for you and Emily
Isn't this forum just great

 

[pargyle]

Steve that is a wonderful gesture. I hope she comes good for you and Emily
Isn't this forum just great

Steve and the Forum - both one of the best ...

 

[E&MBees]

Thank you so much to everyone who has helped me through this tricky time. It is greatly appreciated.

Steve, thank you for your kind offer. I will pm you as requested.

Thanks again,
Emily

 

[Swarm]

Well a quick squint last week told me they are starting to bulge
Six very stuffed frames, I ended up rolling bees getting the first frame out, I wasn't happy about that but I was very happy with the patch of open brood I could see on the next frame.
It was raining by then so I shut them, happy we have a laying queen. I'm planning on going through them tomorrow so I'll take some photos.

 

[The Poot in Somerset]

You’re a top man Steve!

 

[Erichalfbee]

Steve is a man of many talents and a big heart.

 

[E&MBees]

Well a quick squint last week told me they are starting to bulge
Six very stuffed frames, I ended up rolling bees getting the first frame out, I wasn't happy about that but I was very happy with the patch of open brood I could see on the next frame.
It was raining by then so I shut them, happy we have a laying queen. I'm planning on going through them tomorrow so I'll take some photos.

The biggest thank you! So greatly appreciated.

 

[Swarm]

Went through them after squeezing the frames up as tight as I could so I could get the first one out better this time, glad I did as it turned out the queen was on it. Found her when putting it back in.
They have brood on every frame, four of them sealed so will soon be full of young bees.
I did a little video (well my wife did the filming) and took some photos, they are lovely bees.
I didn't mark the queen.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Lovely.
You forced my tapping finger which made me send an email to Jonathan Getty!!!!

 

[Swarm]

I think I told you before about this one? She produced a percentage of ginger workers so I scrubbed her off any queen raising list and used her for drones and brood combs for queen introductions, they are very gentle natured bees.
I must add, she was the only one from a total of about eight, the rest were all black bees.
There she was again this Spring, a big, black goddess. Always pops up to say hello and once again, her bees were gorgeous, still on the combs so I decided I owed her a chance to raise a daughter and hope her bees chose wisely.
Of course we now have the wait and hope to see dark bees emerging.
She is another big girl like her mother.

 

[E&MBees]

I think I told you before about this one? She produced a percentage of ginger workers so I scrubbed her off any queen raising list and used her for drones and brood combs for queen introductions, they are very gentle natured bees.
I must add, she was the only one from a total of about eight, the rest were all black bees.
There she was again this Spring, a big, black goddess. Always pops up to say hello and once again, her bees were gorgeous, still on the combs so I decided I owed her a chance to raise a daughter and hope her bees chose wisely.
Of course we now have the wait and hope to see dark bees emerging.
She is another big girl like her mother.

Beautiful! She looks a lovely queen.

Thank you.