Laying worker

[Haywards]

The virgin Q in one of my colonies has not made it through mating. Not surprising given the awful weather recently. I gave her 3 weeks before a full inspection and there were no signs of a laying Q. I gave her another week because it has been so cold and checked yesterday to find what I think is a laying worker - random brood in single or small groups, multiple eggs in cells and 20 or so play cups.
I have given up all hope on this colony feeling bad about it. I have taken all frames, without brood, from the hive. It was on brood and half and I have 4 full frames and 5 half frames with open brood, nothing capped yet, though drone cells are being drawn. It is a small colony.
After reading past threads on the Forum I plan to freeze the frames and give to a strong colony to clean up if and when the weather improves.
I realise there are only a few frames with a small cost but as a new bk I am loath to destroy drawn brood frames unless it is really necessary.
Should I persevere with my plan or clean up, re-foundation and melt down the remains?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I think you have been a bit premature here - four weeks? especially with the weather I'd have given her longer - don't believe all the hype on here about queens all mating a week after emerging etc.
as for multiple eggs etc - could be the queen 'clearing her throat' before settling down - you will also find some queens laying a lot of drone eggs before settling down. You should have at least waited until the brood was capped before deciding.

 

[jonnybeegood]

The virgin Q in one of my colonies has not made it through mating. Not surprising given the awful weather recently. I gave her 3 weeks before a full inspection and there were no signs of a laying Q. I gave her another week because it has been so cold and checked yesterday to find what I think is a laying worker - random brood in single or small groups, multiple eggs in cells and 20 or so play cups.
I have given up all hope on this colony feeling bad about it. I have taken all frames, without brood, from the hive. It was on brood and half and I have 4 full frames and 5 half frames with open brood, nothing capped yet, though drone cells are being drawn. It is a small colony.
After reading past threads on the Forum I plan to freeze the frames and give to a strong colony to clean up if and when the weather improves.
I realise there are only a few frames with a small cost but as a new bk I am loath to destroy drawn brood frames unless it is really necessary.
Should I persevere with my plan or clean up, re-foundation and melt down the remains?

I had one last Autumn that took 6 weeks before laying, i almost gave up on her being that time of year, now she is a great layer.

 

[oliver90owner]

Queenless colonies do not build drone comb.

You cannot possibly have that much brood from one laying worker.

I will guess here and suggest you have a drone laying queen.

Tell us a vew more facts?

 

[BeeJayBee]

I have given up all hope on this colony feeling bad about it. I have taken all frames, without brood, from the hive. It was on brood and half and I have 4 full frames and 5 half frames with open brood, nothing capped yet, though drone cells are being drawn. It is a small colony.

It's been cold, especially at night. A small colony in brood and a half will be working hard to keep themselves warm, might even be clustering overnight.

Would an unmated queen lay 4 full frames and 5 half frames of only drone brood?

Be more patient!

 

[maddydog]

as for multiple eggs etc - could be the queen 'clearing her throat' before settling down - you will also find some queens laying a lot of drone eggs before settling down. You should have at least waited until the brood was capped before deciding.

Saw this earlier this year with my own eyes. Small patch of Numerous eggs per cells. Suspected laying workers but eggs were all at the base so looked again a week later and the pattern was perfect

 

[Tomo]

I had laying workers last year after the queen failed to return, by week four.
The laying pattern was very much like a shot gun effect maybe alittle less even, but certainly recognisably different to any normal brood. There were a few cells that had a pile of hundreds of eggs. I shook the whole colony into the woods about 200m away. Rebuilt the hive. Put a frame of eggs from another hive and hey presto back to normal eventually.

 

[Tom Bick]

Have had a similar colony this year the bees turned laying workers very fast, some colonies seem to take forever and others very fast. I doubt you will have full frames of drone brood but can be reasonably compact especially if you have a few laying workers. You have to be confident it it laying workers and not a dud queen but the best and easiest method I know to resolve it is to combine with a queen right colony.

 

[Finman]

Would an unmated queen lay 4 full frames and 5 half frames of only drone brood?

Be more patient!

Is it so, that unmated queen has layed that much drones. ... destroy at once the brood and get a new queen. Or take queen off and join then bees to another hive.

You may be as patient as you can, but it does not make things better.

Laying workers does not make much drones. Brood area is quite spotty.

 

[Finman]

.
If I meet a queen, which make punch of eggs into the bottom of the cells, I squeeze it. I do not wait that that damage will become better. That is my queen breeding. No mercy. I must have so much spare queens that I abandon odd queens.

 

[itma]

... checked yesterday to find what I think is a laying worker - random brood in single or small groups, multiple eggs in cells and 20 or so play cups.
I have given up all hope on this colony feeling bad about it. I have taken all frames, without brood, from the hive. It was on brood and half and I have 4 full frames and 5 half frames with open brood, nothing capped yet, though drone cells are being drawn. ...

I do not see that as being conclusive evidence of any particular condition.

Wait until the brood is capped and the workers have had a chance to rearrange the space within the hive - I expect there is likely nectar and pollen stashed randomly, causing an initially fragmented laying pattern.


/// Or have you already ripped the colony apart? Open brood will suffer in probably less than an hour outside the hive and allowed to get cold.

 

[Haywards]

Laying worker - update

Thanks to all for the advice and another learning point for this novice beekeeper.
The colony is still together with empty frames removed and 7 cm Xtratherm insulation filling the void.
I put a clearer board between the brood and half box to get all bees into the brood box so that I could deal with the bees from one box. When I went back to reassemble the frames no bees had moved down and all were busy on the brood frames. Could they be staying with a Q?
I noticed a definite arch of stores and pollen on one of the frames. Does this suggest preparing for a Queen to lay?
Multiple eggs = 2 or 3 eggs in some cells but scattered in no obvious pattern.
More "play cups" or Q cells had been started on bottom bars of the half brood. I cleared them all down and cleaned the bars. Any thoughts on what is going on here?
I use no smoke on this colony, they are very calm even through all this stress I have given them. They are delightful bees.
I estimate that any drone brood will be sealed by next Monday so I will have a quick look then. Any first worker brood will have been sealed, so together with any change to laying patterns, I'll have a better idea of what is going on.

 

[oliver90owner]

Another simple fact learned. Bees do not desert brood (well, not often and never in a case such as this).