How early!

[Finman]

I have read of overfeeding in spring causing swarms as well because the brood area is full of stores?

I have seen tens of times that if queen has not enough space to lay, the hive swarms. That is one the main point in swarm prevention.

Over all if you have accustomed to work with tiny colonies and the you get very big cony bee race, the big colony will make a surprise to you.

In old good days when we had small German Black colonies in Finland, new stock queens failed because they needed 3 fold more space.

 

[Finman]

There are such things as hunger swarms but I haven't seen one,

John Wilkinson

Never heard or read about such one.

If the hives is starving, it leave brood and run to better pastures? - Do you believe that. The swarm has most foragers.

Swarming is natural way to reproduce. Nothing odd in that.

Some beekeepers take swarming as personal insult. They claim that their bees never swarm or sting.

Non swarming stocks are man made via selection.

 

[Crg]

Never heard or read about such one.

If the hives is starving, it leave brood and run to better pastures? - Do you believe that. The swarm has most foragers.

Haven't heard about hunger swarms in European bees, but with some african sub species, hives can abscond if they are starving, or even just because food sources have disappeared from the area.

 

[Finman]

.
Yes. Those African bees do not gather much stores. They move when pastures become dry or bad. Same do some Asian Apis species.

 

[Heather]

Bees do the strangest things.

Great hive, loads of room, food and brood. The queen is a cracker (from Mike- unsolicited praise) and is laying in good pattern.
And there is a queen cell , lovely larvae and royal jelly - why oh why??. So ungrateful and they are not overcrowded.
They have a clean deep brood on which they are drawing well, but SHE has plenty of room for more eggs. I cannot see the reason - but, yes, I know bees don't read the books.
I have moved the Q cell frame, and loads of nurse bees out to a 5 frame Nuc-(frames do contain pollen and syrup), given them some extra syrup and leaving them to get on with it or not. Have loads of capped drone cells in the other hives and a few roaming the hives.
Off to Spain for a week www.nerjaexperience.com so will check on return.

 

[BKF Admin]

Mike may be able to help us out here,I have been told by a few beekeepers that many of the imported queens have been prone to supercedure in the second year ?

 

[Heather]

Well if it happens again on my return from hol - I will split the hive and move the marked queen - and let the original hive accept the new queen - I think - am sure the more experienced will tell me if that wrong .
Heather

 

[Hombre]

Related question. I can see that Heather has hopefully headed off a swarm (or imminent supersedure) and effectively gains a Nuc while away lapping up the sun.

If it is supersedure, will the colony produce another supersedure QC? For the end of the holiday and obviously I have more questions.

Please Heather, follow up on this to it's logical conclusion as it sounds non-textbook as you mentioned and us new-bees are keen to learn from the experiences of others.

Good reason for keeping a spare Nuc to hand.

Have a super holiday.

 

[Poly Hive]

Heather has but postponed the inevitable.

If bees decide to swarm or supercede there is NOTHING the beekeeper can do to STOP it. This is the most basic of lessons that so many fail utterly to understand.

The colony will do what they want to do ALL the beekeeper can do is to guide that decision in the least harmful way (for the beekeeper that is) and the most beneficial way (again for the beekeeper) so that the colony satisfy there decision.

That is what beekeeping is about.

PH

 

[jimbeekeeper]

That is what beekeeping is about.

PH

WHY oh WHY did I take up beekeeping and not keeping Tortoises

 

[Hombre]

I appreciate what you are saying. My point really was that Heather has hopefully bought time for her holiday (fingers crossed) by giving the bees more room and gained a Nuc in the process. The benefit of a supersedure as opposed to a swarm being a potential continuity of laying between the two queens. Am I being too optimistic here?

Is the restrained number of QCs and other circumstances a signature indicating a higher probability of supersedure than swarm intent, or is this exceedingly difficult to ascertain with any certainty?

The desire to swarm will need to be satisfied, but presently the situation is being *guided* on a temporary basis.

I hope that I am not about to fall into the *utterly* camp, despite the apparent naivety of my questions.

Sorry JB, are they the steak and kidney pies with legs?

 

[Heather]

PH
If they make another Q cell and I split the hive leaving the q cell and relocating the marked queen wont that stop the swarming desire.

 

[Finman]

.
If the hive is going to swarm, it makes 10-15 queen cells.
It seems that hive wants to renew the queen.

 

[Heather]

Just the one cell... they don't know a goodie when they see one.
She is worth transferring as she is laying well, great pattern, and 6 full frames this year -so far.

 

[Finman]

.
You may make a nuc with that queen cell and put it over the big hive that they live with heat of main hive. Put entrance to opposite direction

 

[BKF Admin]

Do you want to increase this year Heather ?

 

[Heather]

Yes, I want to try queen breeding by grafting day old eggs. I would like to build up Nucs- but I only want to get back to about 7-8 hives as they are all in my garden. I lost 3 this winter so room to increase. I can give any spare to any new bee keepers at my Brighton Assoc.

 

[Poly Hive]

You need to graft one day old larvae Heather not eggs.

PH

 

[Polyanwood]

Is is too early to do an artificial swarm??? When is OK?

 

[jimbeekeeper]

.

It seems that hive wants to renew the queen.

She is worth transferring as she is laying well, great pattern, and 6 full frames this year -so far.

I think I would agree with Finman, that if they have built a QC (and that is they not the queen!) there is somthing wrong with the queen.

Is this a bad advert for imported queens?