Harvesting supers and overcrowding.

[Illia]

My first year hive which was started from nucleus in early June had super added on after half of month with 8 drawn out combs and after they filled 7 with brood and nectar I decided to add 2nd super .On the 1st of September after inspection I saw that the first super is full of capped honey and 2nd doesn't even have one drawn out frame .
I decided to harvest all fully capped frames (7) and leave others to "ripen" while replacing all of the frames taken with empty ones from 2nd super and removing 2nd super. The problem is hive is really overcrowded : before I removed 2nd supper bees were already siting on the crown board and the inside of the roof .All frames are cowered with them and are really hard to handle, so I didn't inspect brood box for 5 weeks in order to not squish any bees and especially the queen .Is there probability that they will swarm now with even less space (even though they have 7 not drawn out frames)?How am I supposed to remove the last super for the winter if the bees have nowhere to go (after harvest they started bearding 1 centimeter around entrance and ventilating with wings which they haven't done since summer temperature dropped )? Will they starve if they will have only one brood box (after feeding obviously) while population is , so high ?I read that they cannot migrate in cluster into super, so you always need to take all of them off and feed with sugar until they stop taking it instead of leaving their honey .
Also, one of the frames in brood box got bent at the top how do I replace it with the new one ?(Same question about replacing when comb gets brown and old. )Only if they fill it all with honey in spring ?

 

[Frizzaldo]

you probably could have done a split earlier in the summer.
Bee population will be decreasing from here on so the overcrowding problem should be resolved:
https://www.google.ie/search?q=bee+...KHUNAD00Q9QEwBHoECAQQDA#imgrc=aXoVedYbTf3m5M:

you'll need to get over the fear of squishing and learn to inspect even if hive looks very busy.

 

[enrico]

You are worrying too much
You need to learn to handle your bees slowly methodically and gently.
They put up with alot provided you are not rough.
If you have a dummy frame at one end then take that out and that gives you room the lift the next frame out without rolling any bees.
The bees will fit into a brood box as they will reduce their own numbers. They will also put food into the brood box with no problem.
If you are really worried about space add an empty box UNDER the brood box when you take off the last super from above. They will use it if they need it.
Put the bent frame to the outside and when any brood on it has gone then take it out and replace it

Hope this helps, if you are still worried then ask again, we don't mind!!!
E

 

[Illia]

Thanks really useful link !

 

[Illia]

If you are really worried about space add an empty box UNDER the brood box when you take off the last super from above. They will use it if they need it.
E

Won't they need to heat more space now ?and I really doubt I can lift brood box I was already on the verge of breaking my spine while lifting full super. How long should I wait until removing super(for population decrease)?Even if they beard after I remove super they wont swarm, will they ? Is this better to perform a split next summer or add extra brood box in spring ? Also, if the bees have trouble migrating in cluster to super wont they have same problem with 2 brood boxes ?(in Winter)
I don't see any varroa yet if it doesn't appear until end of October should I still treat it ? (Apigard thymol).
Thank you .

 

[Madge]

Won't they need to heat more space now ?and I really doubt I can lift brood box I was already on the verge of breaking my spine while lifting full super. ...

If you can’t lift the brood box, then leave the super where it is. The bees will move up into the super as winter progresses.

Heat rises - so, as long as you’re giving them sufficient insulation above the crown board, they’ll be ok.

In spring, when there are fewer bees in the colony - but strong, you can swap the boxes around so that the colony can move up again into the brood box.

 

[Erichalfbee]

If you can’t lift the brood box, then leave the super where it is. The bees will move up into the super as winter progresses.

Has anybody any experience of actually doing that with a super of fat comb on ten spaces?

 

[Madge]

Has anybody any experience of actually doing that with a super of fat comb on ten spaces?

I’m not sure what you mean with fat combs, Erica - but I often overwinter colonies with a honey shallow containing capped and uncapped stores above the brood box.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Has anybody any experience of actually doing that with a super of fat comb on ten spaces?

Yes - quite a few times - when the queen has managed to get through the QX I've left them overwinter on a brood and a half (shallow on top) with ten frame spacings. Had one last year - super slim queen - went most of the season this way

 

[Erichalfbee]

I’m not sure what you mean with fat combs, Erica - but I often overwinter colonies with a honey shallow containing capped and uncapped stores above the brood box.

I mean....you have deeper combs
Does the queen lay drones in the cells if you leave a honey super there for her to use in the spring

 

[Erichalfbee]

Yes - quite a few times - when the queen has managed to get through the QX I've left them overwinter on a brood and a half (shallow on top) with ten frame spacings. Had one last year - super slim queen - went most of the season this way

All OK, I guess

 

[Swarm]

My friend does this every year. He puts them above an excluder before drones appear.

 

[Madge]

I mean....you have deeper combs

Does the queen lay drones in the cells if you leave a honey super there for her to use in the spring

Oh, I see. No, I haven’t noticed that. My supers aren’t always that fat - but even when they are, the bees reduce the cell depth to fit the brood. Above the brood the fat frame bulges out. I’m sure you’ve seen frames like that.

Also, I’ve often switched the boxes around (moving the super with brood below the deep) by the time they’re thinking about raising drones.