Drone laying workers

[eltalia]

What do you think is happening here ? Laying workers or young inexperienced queen ?

Know.
Same as [attached].

Bill

 

[ShinySideUp]

What do you think is happening here ? Laying workers or young inexperienced queen ?

That's a laying worker...it's also a very good image

 

[thedozzer]

What do you think is happening here ? Laying workers or young inexperienced queen ?

In my very very limited knowledge and even more limited experience, would say new queen, or DLQ as when we did have laying workers they stick them to the side of the cell, well ours did!!

 

[GuyNir]

What do you think is happening here ? Laying workers or young inexperienced queen ?

Clearly laying workers. Many eggs in cells, eggs not centred, random laying no pattern at all...

 

[Frenchie]

So is a drone laying queen missed the period to mate and will therefore never be useful?

 

[GuyNir]

So is a drone laying queen missed the period to mate and will therefore never be useful?

Yes, didn’t mate at all or not mated properly. ‘Game over’ for the colony if not replaced.

 

[Finman]

.
When you have those drone brood, take them off from the hive. Brood have mites. And the colony does not need drones.

 

[Frenchie]

So todays inspection confirmed,one hive queenless, with drone laying workers. Believe their is nothing I can do for this colony? Second colony queenless, no brood or larvae of any sort, so have been queenless for a while. I can introduce a caged,mates queen to this colony,but what are my chances of success? Thanks.

 

[Frenchie]

That should read,caged,mated queen.

 

[Repwoc]

So todays inspection confirmed,one hive queenless, with drone laying workers. Believe their is nothing I can do for this colony? Second colony queenless, no brood or larvae of any sort, so have been queenless for a while. I can introduce a caged,mates queen to this colony,but what are my chances of success? Thanks.

You could try adding a frame of open brood to the laying worker colony. The 'brood pheremone' is supposed to supress the laying worker issue.

At this time with a flow on you should have a good chance of successfully introducing a laying queen, using either a regular queen introduction/travel cage or a push-in cage.

 

[Finman]

So todays inspection confirmed,one hive queenless, with drone laying workers. Believe their is nothing I can do for this colony? Second colony queenless, no brood or larvae of any sort, so have been queenless for a while. I can introduce a caged,mates queen to this colony,but what are my chances of success? Thanks.

Put the queen into a push in cage. From That you see, how friendly bees react on the queen next day.
If they bite the cage, they want to kill the queen.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Re the queen less hive. Steal a frame of emerging brood from another colony put your new mated queen in a push in cage over some of the brood and food.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=OakM0HN0vJI
Laying worker hive shake out.

 

[Frenchie]

When you say shake out do you mean dismantle the hive and leave the bees in the open. Would any be accepted into the remaining queenless hive and therefore cause mote problems?, thanks.

 

[Erichalfbee]

When you say shake out do you mean dismantle the hive and leave the bees in the open. Would any be accepted into the remaining queenless hive and therefore cause mote problems?, thanks.

Ah. If you have only one other hive then no.
You have both your colonies queen less one with laying workers?
Normally a shake out involves taking the box away and letting the bees beg their way into the other hives as you say
You might try shaking them out and putting a caged queen in the middle of the hive. You will lose a few laying workers. Only a few.
I have heard it work but never tried it myself.
Over to the others more experienced than me

 

[Hebeegeebee]

You could try adding a frame of open brood to the laying worker colony. The 'brood pheremone' is supposed to supress the laying worker issue.

At this time with a flow on you should have a good chance of successfully introducing a laying queen, using either a regular queen introduction/travel cage or a push-in cage.

Once you have laying workers the chance of recovering the colony is so small that it's not worth bothering about. A laying worker can have a retinue of workers around her and act like a queen so the chances are, an introduced queens will not survive.

I've tried adding a frame of brood for 3 weeks, once as an experiment. Then introducing a laying queen. She was killed. As 3 frames of brood is a decent nuc, you can see that adding brood to a laying worker colony is not worthwhile. If you need another colony, then start again with a nuc from a good colony.

The difficulty sometimes is identifying whether you have a duff queen or laying workers.
And laying workers can get to the bottom of the cells to lay.

 

[Erichalfbee]

You can combine a LW colony to another really strong queen right one but the poor chap doesn’t have one

 

[eltalia]

So todays inspection confirmed,one hive queenless, with drone laying workers. Believe their is nothing I can do for this colony? Second colony queenless, no brood or larvae of any sort, so have been queenless for a while. I can introduce a caged,mates queen to this colony,but what are my chances of success? Thanks.

See the tute I posted earlier (thread).
The 'advice' this quote(below) is part of is rubbish info - make a
choice, or find out for yourself.
"I have heard it work but I never tried it myself. "

Bill

 

[Haughton Honey]

Once you have laying workers the chance of recovering the colony is so small that it's not worth bothering about. A laying worker can have a retinue of workers around her and act like a queen so the chances are, an introduced queens will not survive.

I've tried adding a frame of brood for 3 weeks, once as an experiment. Then introducing a laying queen. She was killed. As 3 frames of brood is a decent nuc, you can see that adding brood to a laying worker colony is not worthwhile. If you need another colony, then start again with a nuc from a good colony.

The difficulty sometimes is identifying whether you have a duff queen or laying workers.
And laying workers can get to the bottom of the cells to lay.

Agreed. Ditch them and start again.

 

[eltalia]

Once you have laying workers the chance of recovering the colony is so small that it's not worth bothering about. A laying worker can have a retinue of workers around her and act like a queen so the chances are, an introduced queens will not survive.

I've tried adding a frame of brood for 3 weeks, once as an experiment. Then introducing a laying queen. She was killed. As 3 frames of brood is a decent nuc, you can see that adding brood to a laying worker colony is not worthwhile. If you need another colony, then start again with a nuc from a good colony.

The difficulty sometimes is identifying whether you have a duff queen or laying workers.
And laying workers can get to the bottom of the cells to lay.

I've left your post quoted wholly as largely the thrust is entirely accurate, however there
are two elements you might adjust in the belief.
LWS is a condition, one a colony switches to in the absence of a prolonged queenless state
where _no brood_ at _any_ stage is present. Some workers then begin laying, it can be
hundreds. Correction if attempted _must_ remove those eggs/larvae produced _and_
the means to lay more - ergo, no drawn comb. As all bees are of age - it being weeks after
last viable brood was set - all bees can and will fly, given the need. So it is "shaking out"
or any switching of box location just does not work as intended. Likewise for "adding a
frame", it is simply too late as all 'nurse' bees are not true "nurse bees" but morphed aged
workers who will treat the foreigners as 'intruders' and remove the viable brood.
Timing is everything, and so it is LWS not being found/determined until well installed it
is not a great number of bees being "saved" over an apiary. Exceptions occur of course,
one of which is where the helicopter b'keep of a single colony is onto the condition fast
while numbers are still present, then an atrempt is worth the bucks for a mated queen to
be introduced. But only as per my tute earlier, as in our experience - and by anecdotal
report - nothing else "works" as in returning viabilty quickly.

Given differing strains of bees along with cell structure not fitting "one size does all" it is
possible to see LWS eggs at the bottom of cells, mimicing the action of an eager first time
mated queen - even the images on that NBU site show this. However there exists one very
significant most important signal to note - a queen is equipped to *stick* an egg to the Y
of a cell, verticaly. No Apis worker bee on this Planet can do that.
So... in amongst the mess of eggs you will see you look for those standing on end, either
alone or with a few others in the cell - T H A T there is a queen laying.
I did post an image of such into what I believe was a quiz thread, one where clearly the OP
thought an LWS comb was in their posted photo. Not so, wrong... but understandable error.

Thankyou for your post.

Bill

 

[Erichalfbee]

See the tute I posted earlier (thread).
The 'advice' this quote(below) is part of is rubbish info - make a
choice, or find out for yourself.
"I have heard it work but I never tried it myself. "

Bill

Don’t quote one line out of context you twit!
Add the one that follows