Domestic Fly Spray..

[Millet]

I have been watching the bees coming and going in the garden today..several are coming back at hitting the ground unable to take of while erratically trying to take flight and rolling on there backs..to me they are showing all the symptoms that some one has been spraying the odd random bee that has been visiting there garden for what ever reason.. does anyone know if the effects of fly spray on these bees can be transferred secondary to another bee or does it just effect the bee that has been in direct contact with the spray.

 

[Angularity]

It all depends on which one they're using, and what the active substance is. Most will be a pyrethroid of some sort, usually with a quick knock-down action. There are many different sorts. It's unlikely that a bee that's been sprayed would live long enough to be able to fly home, unless it was being sprayed on the other side of the fence. Usually they're on the ground twitching in less than a minute.

If they did make it home then it is possible that they could pass it on via grooming and so on. These things act through the cuticle, and through the stomach. I don't have numbers for the lethal/sub-lethal doses, or the time to death for an average honey bee after an average directed spray. A popular product like Raid has many different versions. The can in front of me now has residual activity, i.e. if you spray it round the window where insects come into the house, it will be active (probably) for a few days. This could be where they're getting it from.

It could also be an aphid spray on flowers, most of which have the same type of actives.

My feeling is that a sub-lethal dose low enough to allow a bee to fly home could be passed from bee to bee but would not wipe out a colony. It could, I guess, kill a few larvae, but very little more.

 

[Erichalfbee]

does anyone know if the effects of fly spray on these bees can be transferred secondary to another bee or does it just effect the bee that has been in direct contact with the spray.

I can’t help you there but fipronil has just crossed my mind. Are there fly sprays with fipronil in them?

 

[bobba]

Hi,

Most household fly sprays contain a combination of 2 active ingredients:

Piperonyl butoxide – This is the waxy white solid you see left deposited by fly spray. Although not harmful on its own in amplifies the effects of other pesticides.

Pyrethrins – this is a pesticide that acts on the nerves system of insects. Its what does the killing in the spray. It is very fast acting.

So firstly, can you see any sings of a waxy white residues on any returning bees?

And are they dying with their tongs hanging out? (this can be a sign of pesticide poisoning)

Domestic fly spray is usually very fast acting, so it is unlikely any bee would make it home after a good dose. However, it could be possible that a bee might make it home if the dose was small or it was sprayed very close to the hive.

I know it is possible to treat hornets with certain active ingredients, so they will carry it back to the hive and often cause damage or destruction of the hive, but slow acting pesticides are selected for this purpose.

I think it’s very unlikely, but not impossible that contaminated bees are returning. If a contaminated bee did make it home the chances are it would have had a low dose, so this would likely limit collateral damage.

 

[Millet]

I have been watching them again and i am going to rule poison out as they are far too lively...however the wings are not equal in shape..one seems narrower than the other and slightly stuck out to the side more than a normal wing..they are appearing to try and take of but unable to..i have had deformed wing virus in my first bees but it is not that but the wings are not right for some reason..i have stood on around ten up to now maybe this is normal but i don't know as i have never seen this before..

 

[pargyle]

CBPV ? Dislocated wings .. classic symptom
.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Do you think it’s K Wing?
Edit.... Pargyle got there before me as I was typing.
It’s why I asked. I had a lot in my collapsed colony

 

[Swarm]

CBPV ? Dislocated wings .. classic symptom
.

 

[Millet]

Do you think it’s K Wing?
Edit.... Pargyle got there before me as I was typing.
It’s why I asked. I had a lot in my collapsed colony

50/50..i had thought about that but but not every bee is the same some are straight but one is still slightly narrower..the bees in question are the three nucs i made up from healthy colonies with the 2019 green Queens.. could these bees have been damaged as sealed brood when i moved them the other week..? ..and if i am unlucky and it is K Wing will it sort its self out when the new Queens brood starts emerging..

 

[Erichalfbee]

I doubt you have damaged brood
All you can do is keep an eye on them

 

[Millet]

Cheers D and everyone else..

 

[Millet]

I doubt you have damaged brood
All you can do is keep an eye on them

Up date and all is fine with the bees..i think i might have my finger on what caused this problem as it is the only thing i can think of..when making these Nucs a good amount of bees where shaken into the nucs..the bees i have seen on the ground could well have been newly emerged bees during the shaking of the frames which caused the damage to the wings and i have noticed the damage now these damaged bees are trying to take orientation flights...? .

 

[Erichalfbee]

I always use super bees to shake into nucs.
Has always worked for me.
Not convinced you can damage new bees wings shaking them into a nuc

 

[Millet]

I always use super bees to shake into nucs.
Has always worked for me.
Not convinced you can damage new bees wings shaking them into a nuc

I have shook bees once or thrice and seen lively and dieing each time ..but hey ho here we go.. ..

This is the only way i can explain the way those bees that could not fly..