does most people on here use Fumidil B?

[Hivemaker.]

I have done a fair bit of searching on treatments for Nosema, I came across a 3-year study done at Ege University in Turkey in 2002. They compared the effectiveness of Fumidil-B and Thymol. To summarize the results:

2002 First Year of treatment:
Fumidil-B, 55 colonies - Avg. 4.98 million spores per bee
Thymol, 55 colonies - Avg. 5.06 million spores per bee
Untreated, 52 colonies - Avg. 5.14 million spores per bee

2003 Second Year of treatment:
Fumidil-B, 40 colonies - Avg. 3.8 million spores per bee, Winter loss: 15 colonies (27%)
Thymol, 53 colonies - Avg. 2.8 million spores per bee, Winter loss: 2 colonies (4%)
Untreated, 31 colonies - Avg. 6.0 million spores per bee, Winter loss: 21 colonies (40%)

2004 Third Year of treatment:
Fumidil-B, 32 colonies - Avg. 3.7 million spores per bee, Winter loss: 8 colonies (20%)
Thymol, 51 colonies - Avg. 0.6 million spores per bee, Winter loss: 2 colonies (4%)
Untreated, 15 colonies - Avg. 6.7 million spores per bee, Winter loss: 16 colonies (50%)

The effectiveness of Thymol appears to be much better than Fumidil-B. The lack of a short term effect on spore counts in the first year can be explained by the fact that Thymol works by inactivating the spore, whereas Fumidil-B works after the spore is activated so many of the spores that were observed in the first year of the Thymol group were most likely inactive (as is supported by the significantly better overwintering stats). There was further evidence of the effectiveness of Thymol in the first year when the Avg. worker counts, brood surface area and honey production are compared between the groups.

The indication of this study is that with Thymol you can reduce the Nosema to a level that will not cause re-infection in subsequent years. Fumidil-B will not bring it down to that level and will require that the colonies be continuously treated (it seems to lose effectiveness over time). In addition the Thymol group outperformed the Fumidil-B group during all years of treatment.

There are also several additional advantages of Thymol:

1. It ******* molds in the syrup and pollen substitute.
2. It has been shown to have a repellent effect on the Small Hive Beetle (IMHO, this is because it ******* the growth of the yeast that SHB infect the pollen with that helps attract them to the hive).

In light of this study and others I have been routinely using Thymol in both my syrup and pollen substitute.

http://www.beekeepingforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=618&page=2

 

[Chris Luck]

I'm easily confused being a blonde, (well, ex blonde), but is there somethiong wrong with my arithmetic?

Untreated, 15 colonies - Avg. 6.7 million spores per bee, Winter loss: 16 colonies (50%)

How can you loose 16 colonies when you only start with 15 and how could that be 50%?

In fact this one doesn't "add up" either...

Untreated, 31 colonies - Avg. 6.0 million spores per bee, Winter loss: 21 colonies (40%)

Chris

 

[Drew]

i'm easily confused being a blonde, (well, ex blonde), but is there somethiong wrong with my arithmetic?

Untreated, 15 colonies - avg. 6.7 million spores per bee, winter loss: 16 colonies (50%)

how can you loose 16 colonies when you only start with 15 and how could that be 50%?
15 + 16 = 31 (colonies at "end of last year") and 16 is give or take 50% of 31

in fact this one doesn't "add up" either...

Untreated, 31 colonies - avg. 6.0 million spores per bee, winter loss: 21 colonies (40%)
ditto 31 + 21 = 52 = "last year" and 21 = circa 40% of 52


chris

hth

 

[Hivemaker.]

You would need to contact those who did the research,but i believe it all leads on from the first year,started with 52 untreated,lost 21 to leave 31 and so on,% from what they started with,which was 52.

 

[biglongdarren]

why was i told to use oil of wintergreen,what is it used to treat or what was it for?
Darren.

 

[Chris Luck]

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, silly old me.

Chris

 

[Hebeegeebee]

Not with the proverbial ten-foot bargepole!

It's easier with a shorter pole.

 

[newportbuzz]

any chance of a copy of the original paper?

 

[Hivemaker.]

http://docsdrive.com/pdfs/ansinet/pjbs/2005/1142-1145.pdf

And a bit more in this link.

http://www.apidologie.org/index.php..._article&access=doi&doi=10.1051/apido/2009070

 

[newportbuzz]

thank you very much thats my reading for the next evening sorted

 

[Swarm]

why was i told to use oil of wintergreen,what is it used to treat or what was it for?
Darren.

I used to rub wintergreen oil into my limbs when I played rugby on a very cold day.

 

[melormynydd]

Quote: Originally Posted by melormynydd
could end up with the mites that cause nosema geting resistant. not good for anyone i think

quote alanf: Is there a typo here? Nosema is a fungus?



yes sory, you are right alanf my mistake i ment fungus not mite

 

[rog]

One wonders how the poor creatures ever managed to survive without us.

 

[oliver90owner]

One wonders how the poor creatures ever managed to survive without us.

They all died!

Remember there were no high concentrations of honey bee colonies (as per apiaries of them) and diseases, if contracted were not so readily spread around like in our apiaries. They were never touched by human hand until relatively few years ago, and certainly not interfered with genetically as has been the case over the last few hundred years.

Survival of the fittest was the order of the day, until Man arrived on the scene and has messed things up.

 

[Onge]

No I never do and never would.

 

[rog]

One wonders how the poor creatures ever managed to survive without us.

They all died!

Remember there were no high concentrations of honey bee colonies (as per apiaries of them) and diseases, if contracted were not so readily spread around like in our apiaries. They were never touched by human hand until relatively few years ago, and certainly not interfered with genetically as has been the case over the last few hundred years.

Survival of the fittest was the order of the day, until Man arrived on the scene and has messed things up.

 

[Skyhook]

why was i told to use oil of wintergreen,what is it used to treat or what was it for?
Darren.

Traditionally a bottle of it with a wick was put in as the vapour reduces acarine. I believe it is from the same group of substances as thymol, so may have some benefit against varroa.

 

[Skyhook]

I was hoping not to use fumidil,Just thymolated syrup.
I have been giving them a jar of thin syrup every 2 or 3 days and will test again next week to see if there's any improvement. If not then it's fumidil,unfortunately.

Given you have 9 healthy hives and one heading down the pan, I would use thymolated syrup in all hives and thymolated syrup and fumidil in the one.

The problem with thymol as I see it is this. If they have a good late flow, the syrup might only constitute a small amount of their stores, therefore you wont get the full effect. Fumidil is, as I understand it, consumed in a smaller quantity of syrup.

 

[Hombre]

Fumadil-B = prophylactic which mitigates the effects of Nosema on the gut wall of the bee.
Thymol = fungicide which kills the Nosema spores in the hive, so that the bees don't suffer an outbreak of Nosema.

Nosema = always there, but hopefully kept in the background by hive hygene, comb changing and a spot of thymol to help with keeping the wards clean.