Complete recovery of laying working colony

Beekeeping & Apiculture Forum

Help Support Beekeeping & Apiculture Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

JonnyPicklechin

Field Bee
Joined
Jun 29, 2015
Messages
533
Reaction score
37
Location
Isleworth
Hive Type
National
Number of Hives
20 odd
Just a quick log for my method of fixing colonies which had developed laying-workers. I have successfully nursed back two colonies from frames of drone brood to healthy laying queens with lovely brood patterns.

Note: There is nothing novel here except the "menu" and "recipe". Many have used these techniques. I am posting here in the Beginners section because as a beginner I had found no documented regimen as such...So thought the following would be useful as a guide. Also its worth pointing out that dependence on where and when in the beekeeping season you encounter a laying worker problem will probably dictate whether you follow this method or the simpler "just shake 'em out" method. I'm not advocating this way particularly - I've got about 20 hives so was able to try this with two affected laying-worker colonies to see what happened...And it worked in both cases. Finally, the very best method for dealing with this issue is not to develop laying workers in the first place!

Simple method during April to July:
1. Obtain a small amount of the substance "Ocimene". It comes in a wee bottle from this supplier Ocimene. I bought 4ml but 2ml will do.
2. Put a couple of drops in a spray bottle filled with water. You'll know if you are happy as the water will smell "just enough" of the ocimene.
3. Remove a couple of frames with drone brood from the target hive and swap them for some decent BIAS frames from a good hive. This will introduce healthy brood to the colony, including the pheromone.
4. With the BIAS frames now in the hive, spray the entire number of brood frames in your BB at the top. You should be able to smell the ocimene. (The ocimene performs the function of emulating the brood pheromone - There are some papers online you can find that explain some experiments)
5. Spray the frames like this each time you are on an inspection. (You don't need to look at the frames anymore.)
6. Every other inspection i.e. 1 in 2, for the next 3 inspections cycles, take out another drone-brood populated frame and swap it (This means with the initial 2 frames you did first, you'll do another 3 swaps.)
7. Spray again each time.

The introduction of eggs / larva will at some stage will invite the bees to make an emergency queen cell. The ocimene ensures they are deterred from creating more laying workers. My sense is that the laying workers either die or simply go off-lay through the process. The new BIAS will finally "catch on" with the existing workers and normal service is resumed after they raise and accept a new VQ.

It took about 10-12 weeks from the original programme start to notice healthy queen brood using this method.

PS One variation I did on one hive, was to introduce a capped QC. However the bees chewed it out. After two separate attempts I remained with the above. Dare say if you keep going they will finally accept the QC and this should speed things up a bit. Probably best to use a good swarm cell if you can spare it...
 
I have used ocimene successfully to prevent laying workers.
Adding normal brood frames as you did will work without the ocimene. One frame weekly four times or so.
It depends whether you have the resources to do so. Remember that the new saved hive has few remnants of the original one and is mostly made up of bees and a new queen from the frames you added
 
I have used ocimene successfully to prevent laying workers.
Adding normal brood frames as you did will work without the ocimene. One frame weekly four times or so.
It depends whether you have the resources to do so. Remember that the new saved hive has few remnants of the original one and is mostly made up of bees and a new queen from the frames you added
And all the time you are taking frames from other colonies ...

I appreciate the method but is it worth it when the shaken out bees will find their way into other colonies and bolster their numbers ?... If I needed more colonies to replace the laying worker ones I'd shake the LW ones out, buy in a laying queen and split a nuc off an existing colony for her to get going with. Or... depending when it was in the season, demaree or simply take a split from a colony intent on swarming.

Life is too short to peel grapes ....
 
And all the time you are taking frames from other colonies ...

I appreciate the method but is it worth it when the shaken out bees will find their way into other colonies and bolster their numbers ?... If I needed more colonies to replace the laying worker ones I'd shake the LW ones out, buy in a laying queen and split a nuc off an existing colony for her to get going with. Or... depending when it was in the season, demaree or simply take a split from a colony intent on swarming.

Life is too short to peel grapes ....
Yes I always think it’s a waste of time. What, after all, are you actually saving.
 
Yes I always think it’s a waste of time. What, after all, are you actually saving.
If I have a lot of bees in such colony, I do add frame of open brood ( usually in two turns work enough). It is much faster and easier for me than shakeout, and I have plenty of brood where bees won't feel loss of 1 brood frame.. Later on change the emergency qcell with good one or eq with good one..
 
If I have a lot of bees in such colony, I do add frame of open brood ( usually in two turns work enough). It is much faster and easier for me than shakeout, and I have plenty of brood where bees won't feel loss of 1 brood frame.. Later on change the emergency qcell with good one or eq with good one..
Yes if you get EQCs in two weeks then it must be worth it with a large colony.
I once had a LW colony that laid up a brood box and two supers in a week. I was absolutely stunned. Single eggs everywhere. Never considered bees could do that.
 
I enjoyed working the solution. I hope it helps others beginners.
If you don't try these things then your beekeeping journey is never complete .... we all need to go down a few dead ends once in a while - a dead end is the signpost to the right road but just once in a while you can find something valuable in a cul-de-sac !
 
If you don't try these things then your beekeeping journey is never complete .... we all need to go down a few dead ends once in a while - a dead end is the signpost to the right road but just once in a while you can find something valuable in a cul-de-sac !
Appreciate the sentiment, though "dead-end" can't be the correct term. A nut still has function even after it has met the sledge hammer. More importantly there is deep meaning in their interaction.
 
It's so long since I dealt with laying workers I can't remember what I did!
However from perusing things on here I wonder if placing a bee-proof grid on top of the LW hive with a shallow eke with entrance above that, and then a queenright hive on top with no floor would sort them out over a few weeks? It would provide queen and brood pheremones to hopefully suppress the LWs. Once you see no more eggs in the LW section you could unite them.
 
It's so long since I dealt with laying workers I can't remember what I did!
However from perusing things on here I wonder if placing a bee-proof grid on top of the LW hive with a shallow eke with entrance above that, and then a queenright hive on top with no floor would sort them out over a few weeks? It would provide queen and brood pheremones to hopefully suppress the LWs. Once you see no more eggs in the LW section you could unite them.
why go to all that fuss - just unite them straight away
 
Because of reports of laying workers killing queens on attempts to unite with queenright hives
I've heard apocryphal tales of it happening with introduced new queens - but not unites.
In any case, the easiest and more practical way if you are just going to unite the laying worker colony is just to shake them out.
 

Latest posts

Back
Top