Clipped queens & swarming and Layens hives

[user 21455]

yes I already thought the space is too big at the sides of the frames and Ive priced up a sheet of 3.5mm plywood at Wickes. I can put a sheet of that on one side and will then end up with 3/8" each side. I read somewhere 1/4" or less and they fill it with propolis 1/2 " or more and they put comb in it or have I imagined this
I have made a dummy board mainly because it made fitting the frames easier.- its just not in the shot. the top bars will touch as per the plans,so the bees can't get into the rebate, although I'm sure they will have a bl**dy good try! lol I could put either aluminium or plastic angle over the rebate if this would make it easier to break any seal the bees make?
the cup hooks are just for me as I was fiddling about, they are not big enough to lift an empty frame never mind a full one as Ive got them labeled ready for transfering either brood or super frames into.
I've watched videos on Youtube where a guy is cutting though brood frames with a circular saw. to fit them in his hive but I haven't the nerve for that. I just want the transfer to be as quick and easy as possible for both parties

 

[user 21455]

What a considered thoughtful reply from someone who has tried the method

yes its given me hope to! Thanks B-North

 

[user 21455]

You will also find that lovely rebate you have created to sit your frames in is going to be a real PITA - they wil propolise the frames in to the rebate and you are going to have a helliuva job prising the first frame out when you inspect - your frame lugs are very short and you may find that there's not much to lever against to het the frames started out of the box. Make a dummy board to go at the end so that you can lift that one out first without stressing the bees and once that is out you have room to move the next frame along a bit before lifting it out. You may also find those very deep frames a bit of a menace unless you are 6' 7" with arms like a gorilla and the sort of physique that can lift a car engine out without a block and tackle.

Sorry...just being constructive - I've been there, got tehe T-shirt and seen the movie !!

You do know about bee space don't you ?

I have to agree - been fiddling around with the hive tool to see what you mean and its hard enough to get the frames out as it is. glad you mentioned it. I'm going to chamfer the edges a bit then I can gerta much more effective angle to lever them out

 

[pargyle]

I have to agree - been fiddling around with the hive tool to see what you mean and its hard enough to get the frames out as it is. glad you mentioned it. I'm going to chamfer the edges a bit then I can gerta much more effective angle to lever them out

You might find the J-type hive tool better for lifting your frames, using the hook end:

https://www.simonthebeekeeper.co.uk...j-end-stainless-steel-half-red-hive-tool.html
Thornes Beekeeping do a pocket version which I find really useful (i have several that I picked up very cheaply in a sale).

https://www.thorne.co.uk/hardware-clothing/tools/pocket-hive-tool.html

 

[Boston Bees]

My physics might be wrong on this, but if you lever up a 19" deep frame are you not going to squash a lot of bees between side bar and wall?

 

[blackcloud]

Shouldn't be learning beekeeping and fringe-hive building simultaneously.
It will end in tears.

And a nosema spike by the sound of it so far.

 

[pargyle]

My physics might be wrong on this, but if you lever up a 19" deep frame are you not going to squash a lot of bees between side bar and wall?

You don't need to lever them up completely - but - if you look at the photos, the frames are set in a rebate and are flush up against each other and they are very short lugs ... they will need a bit of prising to get them to the point where he can lift the frames to inspect. There are no runners to support the frame - they just sit in the rebate. It's not going to be an easy hive to inspect - more so with those ultra deep frames.

I love his creativity but.... as a fellow experimenter and having built my own (self designed) Long Hive at a time when I was still wet behind the ears in beekeeping terms (even more than I am now !) I made all the same mistakes (and more !) in design terms. You don't realise fully how sticky and stuck in frames get once the bees get going and you are right - how easy it is to roll and crush bees, the last thing you want when you inspect, it really does upset them .

I tore apart two hives I made prior to making my Long Hive ... and even then it still has flaws.

There's a lot to be said (in the early days of beekeeping) for following an established pattern (and frame size) for a hive ... hindsight is a wonderfully clear science and if you can stick with something that works it does make life easier and let's face it - the early days of beekeeping are hard enough without making life more difficult.

Me ? I'd tear it apart and use the materials for a re-design - re-work it into 14 x 12 Hoffman frames, put runners into the support ledge, create top bee space, get rid of the space underneath the frames, make sure there is proper bee space at the side of the frames, keep all the insulation and the mesh floor. Or ... save up and buy a ready made poly hive (but where's the fun in that !).

 

[Finman]

If that theory were correct then wild Rabbits would be immune to Myxamatosis etc etc. And on an evolutionary scale Varroa is very new to European Bees so I would imagine resistance will take a long time and I don't want them to become a scource of infection to other hives.
Any thoughts?

In Siberia varroa and European bee has been together 100 years . There is an odd resistance in bees, but the style is very strange. It can be seen in US Russian bee.
Mite resistance of Russian bees cannot be transfered in crossing to another bee races.

 

[user 21455]

well seems to me this forum is full of criticism rather than encouragement so have a good life
its not for me

 

[Boston Bees]

well seems to me this forum is full of criticism rather than encouragement so have a good life

Byeeeee, you too.

 

[pargyle]

well seems to me this forum is full of criticism rather than encouragement so have a good life
its not for me

Criticism ? Thread is full of good advice so far... if you can't accept ideas for improvement what is the point of bringing a novel idea to a forum where there are thousands of people who may have something that you can take away that is helpful - it's a bit soon to make a judgement after a couple of days. Stick around and you may learn something...

 

[user 20297]

well seems to me this forum is full of criticism rather than encouragement so have a good life
its not for me

I wouldn't blame you for stopping your posts to the forum, but in fairness, most of the responses to you have been frank and constructive; I've seen much worse.
You happen to have chosen what many beekeepers here would consider to be a fairly niche hive and are considering a "treatment" regime that doesn't receive wide approval.
A wide variety of beekeeping approaches are taken by members of this forum, but as with any hobby, there is a general consensus on many matters. By definition, minority techniques feature less frequently, and your reaction maybe shows that in addition, many "off-piste" beekeepers are reluctant to continue, with criticism coming from all directions.
Constructing any hive from scratch before having prior experience of how bees behave in a hive is bound to be almost impossible to do to perfection. But all credit to you for doing so....you'll find that being "handy" will be a major benefit to your beekeeping in the future. Please keep posting and honestly advise us how things go.

 

[blackcloud]

well seems to me this forum is full of criticism rather than encouragement so have a good life
its not for me

I found exactly the same - but so is the real world.
Suck it up.
You have been given damn good advice from several people, based on experience you don't yet possess.
They have made the mistakes you don't need to.
That's a wonderful gift- free of charge- take it or leave it.

Are you the salt guy by any chance?

 

[user 21455]

Right these are the plans I followed
https://borrowedvesselsbeeworks.com/beehive/free-plans/399-2/the rebate etc is mentioned in them if you think its bad advice tell them. I didn't draw them
PS I have nothing to do with salt so I don't know what thats about

 

[Erichalfbee]

well seems to me this forum is full of criticism rather than encouragement so have a good life
its not for me

Well that’s such a shame. You’ve been given a lot of good advice here. You’d never have got a tenth of the help anywhere else. I hope you stick around.

 

[Erichalfbee]

PS I have nothing to do with salt so I don't know what thats about

Pay no heed.
It’s a joke about something else?

 

[Boston Bees]

Right these are the plans I followed
https://borrowedvesselsbeeworks.com/beehive/free-plans/399-2/the rebate etc is mentioned in them if you think its bad advice tell them. I didn't draw them
PS I have nothing to do with salt so I don't know what thats about

That was the quickest return ever!

 

[blackcloud]

Right these are the plans I followed
https://borrowedvesselsbeeworks.com/beehive/free-plans/399-2/the rebate etc is mentioned in them if you think its bad advice tell them. I didn't draw them
PS I have nothing to do with salt so I don't know what thats about

Please -it's not about your plan.
What you are being told is:

1 Learn basic beekeeping first- if that's what you are really trying to do.
2 It's best done in well proven ,readily accessible,interchangeable format hive.
3 Hold off the woodwork until you know how a hive is supposed to work - it will save lots of time effort and dead bees.

No one is attacking you -they are all trying to help you but if you disregard good advice you will inevitably become a source of entertainment - the salt guy

 

[Murox]

Perhaps the issue is the way advice is given and of course it comes essentially from our own perspective; too much advice can be seen as a subtle form of scorn. We don't have the ability to walk in the shoes of others and as the Dalai Lama once said

“People take different roads seeking fulfilment and happiness. Just because they’re not on your road doesn’t mean they’re lost.”

 

[user 20297]

That was the quickest return ever!

......I'm sure what you really mean is, "Welcome back."