Caucasian queen wanted

[Maddmax1]

Let us go back the the very reason of this thread, shall we?! SO, it is clear that nobody knows where to find a legal Russian VSH line in Europe.
About Foghornleghorn's post ... does anyone know where to find the USDA VSH traits introgressed into ANY background?
Maddmax1

 

[Finman]

.. Madd, Europe has very strong bee breeding system too to breed varroa resistant bees. You should reviele out, what they are doing, before you start your breeding ptogram. USA is about 10-15 years behind European varroa control.

Then flying ticket to some German bee breeding centre. And to France.

You could contact to professor Nanetti in Italy, and ask, what he knows about the issue. Vain to ask from this hobby forum.

What I read about Caucasian bees in USA, it has became quite rare there. I bet that in Europe it is rare too.


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[B+.]

About Foghornleghorn's post ... does anyone know where to find the USDA VSH traits introgressed into ANY background?
Maddmax1

Yes. VSH bees from USDA Baton Rouge are being used by members of Arista Bee Research in testing both Buckfast and Carniolan lines (https://aristabeeresearch.org/varroa-resistance/)

 

[Finman]

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About those mite resistant bee strains...

We have in Finlad two well known beekeepers, who do not treat their hives.
But they have now started to consider to treat their hives, because mite makes so much damage to hives, that it cuts best profits from beekeeping economy.

In another words, mite resistant bees are too expencive in honey production.

One sign is too , that breeders themselves arvertise their bees as miracles, but "markets" = professional beekeepers do not use those strains. Strains' productivity is so low, that they would drop out of competition.

Make a calculation: Selling price minus production costs . Then add on top extra crop 20%.

That is my opinion, but why those miracles do not work in practical industry level?

On hobby level those " I never treat" guys seldom tell, how much they extracted honey.

It is good to live in Hope, said a tape worm.

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[B+.]

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About those mite resistant bee strains...

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If they were only selected for one trait, it is understandable that others (i.e. honey production) might be lost. This is a calculation that your beekeepers will have to make.
In BeeBreed, colonies are tested for a range of traits (i.e. honey production, varroa tolerance, aggression, stability on the comb, reluctance to swarm in addition to spring build-up and over-wintering ability). So, they are selected for a portfolio of characteristics, not just one.
It is difficult to address your concern about the benefits of a breeding programme coming through into industry without knowing how they were produced. If they simply bought a "breeder queen" and produced lots of daughters from her, it would depend on what drones they were mated to. It also depends on inheritance.

I revealed a lot of my results during the course of 2015 as the tests progressed, so, I don't think your point about disclosure of figures is correct.

 

[Finman]

Of course I am wrong. No alternatives to that.

I did not say that what you offer to my mouth.
I have breeded too queens 50 years.

 

[B+.]

Of course I am wrong. No alternatives to that.

I didn't say that you were wrong Finman. I was merely suggesting a possible explanation of what you described. I often hear of people wanting to breed from a single "breeder" queen without a thought to what drones the daughters will mate with. This is not the way to do it

 

[Hivemaker.]

Of course I am wrong. No alternatives to that.

I did not say that what you offer to my mouth.
I have breeded too queens 50 years.

Since varroa have you had any bees that need no varroa treatment at all.

 

[Finman]

Since varroa have you had any bees that need no varroa treatment at all.

I used 10 years Elgon bees which should tolerate mites. When I used oxalic acid, hives had as much mites as others. But strain had other good advantages. One was that they foraged huge amounts of pollen, and they reared brood despite of weathers, when I gove pollen patty. Build up was fast. But they were quick to starve too in spring. I could say that they were weather resistant. Others slow down quickly brooding when bad weathers come.

Worst thing was that they had African bee genes (monticola), and when they crosses with Italians, some of them were dangerous, not perhaps to me, but to by passers and to farm animals.

When one hive gove during one inspection 70 stings to my face through the protection net, I realized, that these can kill somebody . It took 3 yeas that those features vanished from my area.
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i have heard that Kefys bees are very angry too. One our breeder tried them and he said, that look at pictures, how well guys have protected themselves. That breeder killed the hives after couple of years. That guy has breeded many animals and he is real professional.

 

[Finman]

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Some years ago I met on forum an Alaskan beekeeper, who had 10 Russian hives. He told that mite kills them as well as other bees. But he told too that in Alaska they have habit to kill anyway colonies in late summer and buy new package bees in April.

In Alaska they use queens from south and no insulated hives. That is why they do not succeed in wintering.

 

[Finman]

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I have bought so much queens from breeders during decades, that I do not even expect that they are honest what they say or what they sell.

But when I have followed "mating weathers", Queen breeding is very risky business. I am not angry to them who try to do it.

 

[B+.]

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In Alaska they use queens from south and no insulated hives. That is why they do not succeed in wintering.

However, in Manitoba they can over-winter bees using insulation wraps and packing bales of straw around them (e.g. http://www.frenchbeefarm.com/housse-hivernale/)

 

[Finman]

Yupla



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[Finman]

However, in Manitoba they can over-winter bees using insulation wraps and packing bales of straw around them (e.g. http://www.frenchbeefarm.com/housse-hivernale/)

I know Canadian wintering system. And they have done big comparative wrapping material research in Canada. If you look Alaska beehives, they are same thin wall boxes as in Florida

Up to 1975 beekeepers wintered hives on Florida, Texas and so on, and moved their hives up to Canada canola fields. Then Canada closed the border and did not let US beekeepers to they pastures.

In USA migrative beekeeping had mixed the beebreeding so, that no one speak about climate adapted bee strains. So they must keep 3 Langstroth boxes food (60 kg) over winter that they survive in Michigan or in New York state.

Further more, when I was in Beemaster forum, Californian beekeepers adviced the Michigan beekeepers, how to over winter bees. California may have +25C in December and Michigan -25C.

And how they were same like UK beekeepers. Nothing to be learn from overseas. Same in NZ.



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[Hivemaker.]

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We have in Finlad two well known beekeepers, who do not treat their hives.
But they have now started to consider to treat their hives, because mite makes so much damage to hives, that it cuts best profits from beekeeping economy.

That is no surprise, some fare slightly better than others, but not found any that are of much use in commercial beekeeping here either.

 

[Finman]

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Finland has copied beekeeping system from USA and adapted it to its own needs. I do not know how many persons that has needed, but it happened. It has not been copied from neighbouring countries.

 

[B+.]

And how they were same like UK beekeepers. Nothing to be learn from overseas. Same in NZ.

Perhaps that is true of some, but not all.