Building a National Hive

[Anduril]

I completely understand your point of view from a commercial basis, especially with regard to weight.
However, we don't use poly because it's unsustainable in this neck of the woods.
We have gone for thicker wood instead, not because wood is sacrosanct, but because at present, it's the best option.
I would like to see some of the poly v wood statements statistically analysed though.
There's usually very little reference made to thickness of either product.
If it's standard National v standard poly, then I'm sure the poly would win hands down.
What about all the other flavours though?

Derekm would have all the r values regarding poly and wood. This may be of interest at about 11 minutes in https://youtu.be/uICY0sEIx2Q
In my neck of the woods poly is recyclable.

 

[bingevader]

The recycling bit is so frustrating as it apparently very easy to do!
Re: the Youtube vid, I'd just like to know where Joe got his figures!

 

[pargyle]

I completely understand your point of view from a commercial basis, especially with regard to weight.
However, we don't use poly because it's unsustainable in this neck of the woods.
We have gone for thicker wood instead, not because wood is sacrosanct, but because at present, it's the best option.
I would like to see some of the poly v wood statements statistically analysed though.
There's usually very little reference made to thickness of either product.
If it's standard National v standard poly, then I'm sure the poly would win hands down.
What about all the other flavours though?

I think sustainablity is as much about longevity in use .. as long as poly hives are maintained with an occasional coat of paint to protect them from UV light they are virtually indestructible .. some of the earliest poly hives still in use are 25-30 years old and still going strong. Seems to me there is little need for recycling .. indeed ... should they get damaged beyond repair - cut them up and use the slabs as top insulation where it will last forever.

As for studies...there are quite a few .. our DerekM on this forum has made a sizeable study(ies) of what bees really experience in relation to plain uninsulated timber hives through to hives made out of Kingspan and Celotex ..

Very early on in my beekeeping a former forum member, MikeA, took some thermal images to compare timber and polystyrene hives heat loss .. I can't find them at present... some of them were of my double walled, polystyrene sandwich, long hive ... very interesting and enlightening.

I, for one, don't need any convincing.

 

[Angry_Mob]

https://beekeepingforum.co.uk/showpost.php?p=389540&postcount=383

Attachment doesn't seem to be working.

 

[bingevader]

I, for one, don't need any convincing.

I don't need convincing either, just looking for a compromise in wood that isn't a log hive!

 

[pargyle]

https://beekeepingforum.co.uk/showpost.php?p=389540&postcount=383

Attachment doesn't seem to be working.

Yes .. that's them but for the life of me I can't find the original images ... I thought I had some of them but it was back in 2014 and I've changed computers since then ... possibly on a USB stick somewhere ...

 

[Poly Hive]

Your're at least 10 years short. Poly has been in the UK since the early 80's if not the late 70's. I bought my first ones in 89.

PH

 

[pargyle]

Your're at least 10 years short. Poly has been in the UK since the early 80's if not the late 70's. I bought my first ones in 89.

PH

My understanding was that, whilst they were available in Europe (particularly the colder regions) from the 1970's they were not readily available in the UK until the late 1980's and even then it took some time for British National sizes to be made.

I know of at least one beekeeper that has two or three poly hives he purchased around the same time as you that are still serviceable - there's nearly as much paint on them as there is poly now ! - and still in use. Hence my comment about longevity ...ie: 25-30 years.

But .. I'm sure there is someone out there that has a poly box in use from even earlier in the UK. Finnie, certainly, has had bees in poly boxes for 50 years .... albeit in Finland..

We are pretty slow to catch on to good ideas in beekeeping in the UK aren't we ?

There are still many die hards I speak to who cannot accept any of the benefits of polystyrene hives ... indeed, even deny that they have any advantages ...

 

[Poly Hive]

My understanding of the history is that the first that I know of was B. Mobus who brought his in from Germany. As the NOSCA college advisor for the North of Scotland he got his bee farmer Hamish Robertson of Struan Apiaries interested and he, in turn, imported a container load from Germany and began seling them by as was the only way really then word of mouth. This was by the late 80's as I met Hamish via Bernard.

PH

 

[ericbeaumont]

I completely understand your point of view from a commercial basis, especially with regard to weight.

There is a perception that hobby beekeepers and beefarmers have different priorities and ne'r the twain shall meet, but the reality is that they have a great deal in common: what starts out as a hobby morphs into a passion that evolves into a full-time job, but the ethos remains the same for both parties: if you love what you do, learn to do it well and treat your livestock well. Numbers are merely incidental.

Thus the decision facing beginner and seasoned beefarmer is much the same: which is the most cost-efficient box that matches the thermal needs of a colony as closely as possible, so giving bees the optimum opportunity to thrive and produce strong colonies and good crops?

In that context, poly wins hands down for both Emily and Murray, no matter which way you look at it.

 

[pargyle]

My understanding of the history is that the first that I know of was B. Mobus who brought his in from Germany. As the NOSCA college advisor for the North of Scotland he got his bee farmer Hamish Robertson of Struan Apiaries interested and he, in turn, imported a container load from Germany and began seling them by as was the only way really then word of mouth. This was by the late 80's as I met Hamish via Bernard.

PH

Exactly ... Isn't that what I said ?

 

[Poly Hive]

Sorry I should have said that Mobus was using them in the very early 80's if not the late 70's hence my comment about the 10 years. Not that it really matters over all.

PH