bees on 2 and 3 frames for wintering

[haily]

I have 3 small nucs(in national hives dummied down with insulation frame) I need to get ready for wintering. All queens are newly mated at end of July/start of Aug and one has only started laying 2 weeks ago!

Last weeks inspection
In hive1, its on 3 frames of capped brood. Last week I gave 2 empty drawn comb for more room for laying because queen was running out of space.

Hive2, on 2 frames of brood with plenty of stores. I gave 1 frame of drawn comb for more room for laying like I did with hive1.

Hive3, bees on 3 frames(no brood) with newly mated queen only started laying just over 2 weeks ago in 1 and half frames( not capped last week).

I was given hive3 for free from another beekeeper who moved away for work. She has another 2 boxes with small amount of old bees that are Queen less, no brood, no eggs, larvae. These other 2 boxes are 4 miles away and will be picking them up at some point today.

I have purchased 50kg of sugar for feeding and I'm in 2 minds whether to treat for varroa because the hives are so weak.

I know this is a sticky situation these hives are in but with help on here, I could have them ready for overwintering. I will be ringing about later to buy a nuc, unite 2 frames each into all hives and unite the new bees with the hive3 and hopefully they should be strong enough for overwintering.

Regards
Haily

 

[Finman]

.
If you have in a nuc 3 frames brood, the colony will bees 3 frames for winter.
Its life is very difficult in next spring.

If you join those 2 and 3 brood frames, you get a minimum size hive for Winter.
That size of 5 frame colony needs 10-12 kg Sugar for Winter.

 

[TryingToLetThemBee]

Your unspecified location deprives us of the info needed to answer this. If you want questions like this answered, please have the good manners to change it or go on the ignore list.

 

[Excession]

Your unspecified location deprives us of the info needed to answer this. If you want questions like this answered, please have the good manners to change it or go on the ignore list.

Wow... So stroppy!

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

must have found a mouse turd in hic coco pops this morning but yes to a point - a more specific location may be more than a bit helpful

 

[REDWOOD]

I have 3 small nucs(in national hives dummied down with insulation frame) I need to get ready for wintering. All queens are newly mated at end of July/start of Aug and one has only started laying 2 weeks ago!

Last weeks inspection
In hive1, its on 3 frames of capped brood. Last week I gave 2 empty drawn comb for more room for laying because queen was running out of space.

Hive2, on 2 frames of brood with plenty of stores. I gave 1 frame of drawn comb for more room for laying like I did with hive1.

Hive3, bees on 3 frames(no brood) with newly mated queen only started laying just over 2 weeks ago in 1 and half frames( not capped last week).

I was given hive3 for free from another beekeeper who moved away for work. She has another 2 boxes with small amount of old bees that are Queen less, no brood, no eggs, larvae. These other 2 boxes are 4 miles away and will be picking them up at some point today.

I have purchased 50kg of sugar for feeding and I'm in 2 minds whether to treat for varroa because the hives are so weak.

I know this is a sticky situation these hives are in but with help on here, I could have them ready for overwintering. I will be ringing about later to buy a nuc, unite 2 frames each into all hives and unite the new bees with the hive3 and hopefully they should be strong enough for overwintering.

Regards
Haily

Hive one has 3 frames of capped brood so most probably has another 2 frames of open brood so a total of 5 frames that if kept dummied down and insulated should make it if there is enough pollen and stores. I would take a look at hive three's laying patten first before uniting it now that you should have sealed brood to determine state of queen.

 

[haily]

.
If you have in a nuc 3 frames brood, the colony will bees 3 frames for winter.
Its life is very difficult in next spring.

If you join those 2 and 3 brood frames, you get a minimum size hive for Winter.
That size of 5 frame colony needs 10-12 kg Sugar for Winter.

I was going to buy another nuc, add 2 frames into each hive and feed rather that just unite the 2 I have now. Best to overwinter with 2(or3) nucs rather than 1 I'd imagine. I already have the sugar and a good friend has offered me 1 (3/4 full) super if I needed it for the bees.

 

[haily]

Hive one has 3 frames of capped brood so most probably has another 2 frames of open brood so a total of 5 frames that if kept dummied down and insulated should make it if there is enough pollen and stores. I would take a look at hive three's laying patten first before uniting it now that you should have sealed brood to determine state of queen.

Seeing as its so late in season, would hive 1&2 have time to fill these 2 empty frames with brood. I wasnt going to enter these hives for another week or 2 but might need to take a frame or 2 to put in the Queen less hives from the other location just so I know they are 100% -Q before I unite. Another beekeeper suggested I just leave uniting them because they are old bees and would be dieing out soon anyway and moving them and uniting with all that empty space could stress the main colony.

 

[haily]

Your unspecified location deprives us of the info needed to answer this. If you want questions like this answered, please have the good manners to change it or go on the ignore list.

Changed!

 

[TryingToLetThemBee]

Thanks. Right. So v different from me for example; I could contemplate overwintering that lot in nuc boxes; you cannot. Personally I would combine the STRONGEST and the weakest since I am too wimpy to go down to one (but you may have to later) and see how much I could build the two colonies up. Search @derekm 's posts for tips on dummying down; you may not be getting much benefit and ideally at least the now smaller colony should really be in a poly nuc. They are good things to have and you might want to look into getting one for at least the month you have left to decide fibally your winter configuration.

ADD When you say "buy a nuc", do you mean just box (as I guess and would agree, as I said) or colony?

 

[TryingToLetThemBee]

Wow... So stroppy!

Sorry but if you look at lifetime or otherwise bannees they always have unspecified locations so for that and other reasons it rings my bell.

 

[Finman]

Sorry but if you look at lifetime or otherwise bannees they always have unspecified locations so for that and other reasons it rings my bell.

Others are banned when your bells/balls? ring.
It is called win/win situation.

 

[Finman]

Best to overwinter with 2(or3) nucs rather than 1 I'd imagine..

They are all as bad or in miserable contion after Winter... I do not imagine. I know. Life teaches.

 

[yeogi75]

Sorry but if you look at lifetime or otherwise bannees they always have unspecified locations so for that and other reasons it rings my bell.

little like outer London a nubie mistake chillout

 

[TryingToLetThemBee]

little like outer London a nubie mistake chillout

Well yes, a noobie mistake and readily rectified so no jonnybeegood. But, no, "countryside" is not like "Outer London" in that it covers many hundred miles of latitude not twenty. And many were used.

 

[Hawklord]

Choose best queen, unite all 3 nucs, and condense into 2 brood boxes in a weeks time. You have more chance of loosing 3 small nucs as 1 big colony. I over wintered 1 colony for 3 years running with no loss.

 

[philipm]

Better to have one good strong colony going into winter than 2 or 3 weak ones. I found this out at my own expense a few years ago when I lost everything because of my own stupidity thinking how nice to go into winter with more than one hive.You can always split them again next year.

 

[haily]

Got an opportunity at 5pm to inspect and hive 1&2 the queens haven't started laying in the empty Combs yet but have laid more eggs where brood has hatched. Why is it these queens haven't went near these new frames yet?

Hive 3 has capped brood on 4 frames but its only in the top right corners of the frames. Again, why would a queen do this when there's plenty of room elsewhere.

I was also away picking up the other hives and they have bees on 4&5 frames but no brood,eggs,larvae just as the other beekeeper said.

 

[haily]

Choose best queen, unite all 3 nucs, and condense into 2 brood boxes in a weeks time. You have more chance of loosing 3 small nucs as 1 big colony. I over wintered 1 colony for 3 years running with no loss.

How do I unite 3 hives? I seen how to unite 2 before but wouldn't stacking 3 on top of each other create to much space to heat for these bees seeing as how small colonies they are.

 

[TryingToLetThemBee]

2 stages; newspaper only lasts 24 hours. If you do go that route you'll have some frame shuffling to do but you have a bit of time: if you emerge even eggs above a QE you are still inside September.