Bailey comb change timing.

[jenkinsbrynmair]

OK, I am going to stick my head above the parapet... I understood it as:

shook swarm - to get bees onto clean foundation, feed them so they can draw it, and dispose of all the original brood and combs. Used in some cases of EFB so that bacteria are "locked" into the new comb as the bees work the foundation. (Not sure I believe that bit, myself).

Bailey change - to get the bees onto clean comb or foundation, (feeding them so that they can draw it), and keep the original brood...(ie allow it to emerge).

With a Bailey change, the warmth from the brood nest below helps in the drawing of the wax. (Comb can be rotated so that foundation is brought near the middle for working). Can't be done too early or on a puny colony.

Think that about sums it all up

 

[Matt77]

This is how I understand it too. Apologies if I've not been clear.

 

[BeeJayBee]

OK, I am going to stick my head above the parapet... I understood it as:

shook swarm - to get bees onto clean foundation, feed them so they can draw it, and dispose of all the original brood and combs. Used in some cases of EFB so that bacteria are "locked" into the new comb as the bees work the foundation. (Not sure I believe that bit, myself).

Bailey change - to get the bees onto clean comb or foundation, (feeding them so that they can draw it), and keep the original brood...(ie allow it to emerge).

With a Bailey change, the warmth from the brood nest below helps in the drawing of the wax. (Comb can be rotated so that foundation is brought near the middle for working). Can't be done too early or on a puny colony.

Also, shook swarm is quick and instant, apart from needing to feed until they've drawn enough comb. If it's done when a colony starts building swarm cells then comb can be drawn very quickly - because the colony is in the right frame of mind and 'preparedness' for it.

Bailey Frame Change is slower, it will usually take three weeks to get the old comb out because you need to wait for all eggs/larvae to develop.

 

[wessexmario]

No disease concerns, I have two colonies which I bought last year. I do not know how old the comb is, ...

What colour is the wax in the combs?
The darker it is, the older, in the brood box it can get completely black as over time the pupa cases build up and slowly replace the wax in the cells.

If you're not sure, post a photo, and an average of poster's estimates should produce a reasonable age for you.

 

[Brian Bush]

Bailey comb change is often a waste of time. Any unwanted pathogens you are just going to pass from the old comb to the new.
If you need to change the comb do a shook swarm onto 3 or 4 frames with a dummy board and feed with syrup. Make sure you have adequate insulation so the syrup does not get too cold. Use a frame feeder if available. Add more frames as the bees draw the comb.

 

[Matt77]

What colour is the wax in the combs?
The darker it is, the older, in the brood box it can get completely black as over time the pupa cases build up and slowly replace the wax in the cells.

If you're not sure, post a photo, and an average of poster's estimates should produce a reasonable age for you.

I don't have any pictures of the comb, although to my mind it does look fairly old & dark. I do appriceiate I'm not experianced but compared to my other nuc I bought last year it is very dark. None of which is very helpful I'm sure.

I think perhaps I'll wait until I do an AS. But in the mean time I'd like to try and get rid of the unspaced frames. The unspaced frames are right in the middle of the brood nest so are always full of brood. Is it feasable to move it one frame along at each insepction, then when its free of brood whip it out & replace with foundation?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

The unspaced frames are right in the middle of the brood nest so are always full of brood. Is it feasable to move it one frame along at each insepction, then when its free of brood whip it out & replace with foundation?

That's what I would do, you may be lucky with the first inspection and find some of them broodless, just remember that early season the bees are reluctant to draw comb, so make sure the queen has plenty of space to lay beforer taking a load of frames out.

 

[Matt77]

Thanks for confiming that, I'll knock the idea of a Bailey change on the head then.

Cheers all.