Alternatives to Buckfast bees

[foghornleghorn]

Carniolan - superb spring buildup, excellent honey production if properly managed, very strong swarming tendency. There are some excellent strains available in Europe. More important, there is a huge amount of breeding work going on with these bees so long term improvement is assured.

Caucasian - good performance where fall flows are the primary honey crop, very strong tendency to collect propolis. IMO, these bees are more of a niche than a mainstream breed.

Italian - excellent overall performance whether spring or fall flows, tends to maintain very strong colonies year round which can cause problems in mid-summer and during long winters where they can consume all their honey. There is a lot of work ongoing to improve Italians, but most of it is for Mediterranean climates or for migratory beekeeping.

Native black bees - exceptionally good wintering, adapted to adverse conditions, medium honey production, can be aggressive especially when crossed to other races. These bees are arguably best adapted for smallholders with a few colonies of bees that are not heavily managed.

Its important to add to that there is more variation within those separate species than across all types you mentioned. So a black bee that hasnt had any serious breeding gone into it is unlikely to be able to outperform bees with probably 100+ years breeding at this stage, but they do have the potential to be as good as any other breed maybe better because they are a much stronger,longer lasting bee than the likes of Italian's

 

[For want of a better word]

Native black bees - exceptionally good wintering, adapted to adverse conditions, medium honey production, can be aggressive especially when crossed to other races. These bees are arguably best adapted for smallholders with a few colonies of bees that are not heavily managed.
Poppycock... more cut and paste form someone who has probably never even been to Anglesea.. Llanfair PG does it for me... Victorian invention for an insignificant railway halt to drag in the tourist and spend three farthings on a platform ticket!

Yeghes da

 

[B+.]

Victorian invention for an insignificant railway halt to drag in the tourist and spend three farthings on a platform ticket!

You're showing your age....lots of people probably wouldn't even know what a platform ticket was now.

 

[Fusion_power]

Her stutter must have been pretty bad then as it wasn't even called that then (but neither was america), it wasn't even called that when my great great great grandmother was born there around 1830 just before the victorians invented the name

She lived to 96 and died in 1888. I know very little about her beyond a few letters kept by family members where she corresponded with family in her former home. We got the name of the town from the letters.

I've never been to England so I don't claim to know much about either the land or the bees. I've only been beekeeping 46 years so I should be able to learn a few more things over the next 46.

Its important to add to that there is more variation within those separate species than across all types you mentioned. So a black bee that hasnt had any serious breeding gone into it is unlikely to be able to outperform bees with probably 100+ years breeding at this stage, but they do have the potential to be as good as any other breed maybe better because they are a much stronger,longer lasting bee than the likes of Italian's

I'm convinced Brother Adam was on the right track that crosses carefully selected and then stabilized can achieve more progress with bee breeding than selection within a race. There is still a huge need to conserve and develop the various races so we maintain the ability to breed and select in the future.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I've never been to England so I don't claim to know much about either the land or the bees.

Obviously Llanfair PG is in Wales

 

[maddydog]

Her stutter must have been pretty bad then

 

[Fusion_power]

Dear Mom,

I learned something new today. I found out that Wales is a separate country kind of like Canada is not the United States. I also found out that they speak a different language than all the rest of the U.K. Kind of like we don't speak the same language as people from Georgia or Tennessee cept maybe our relatives up in Clarksville. Do you think maybe the people in Wales were as lucky as us to be born in a place like Alabama, we do have most of the rednecks and hillbillies in this part of the country! All I can say is they kin at least communikate with us, they do speak English as a 2nd language. I wuz able to ast em about great great great Grandmaw 'Lainie Jones and they knew right where she was from. Tell Uncle Unibrow I'll be there for his birthday party, we all want to celebrate him turning 107 and all. We don't want any hick-ups at the party!

Take care,

Yur lovin son.


Fortunately for all of us, bees do NOT understand English. Fortunate for this forum, a sense of humor is required.

Now could we get back to figuring out if beekeepers can communicate better than bees?

 

[For want of a better word]

Dear Fission_ fizzle
Numerous different languages are still spoken along the Western fringes of the British Isles... and like the Native bees are very much extant and somewhat similar to each other.. it seems that JBM and myself are distantly related cousins.....
enjoy your pickled grits.. you certainly must have a lot of hog guts over the pond!

Yeghes da

 

[Fusion_power]

I grew up on a farm, among other things raising pigs. From the time I was 5 years old, I can remember the family getting together to slaughter a pig and from 12 years old, I helped with scraping and gutting and cutting and packaging the meat. Yes, I'm familiar with hogs. Are you?

I got my first 2 colonies of bees when I was 10 years old. By the time I was 16, I had 15 colonies. My parents were supportive but could not afford to buy equipment so I had to make my own. I could set up bait hives and catch a few swarms per year. Most were the black bees endemic to this region. Among the first things I had to learn was how to requeen with Italian queens so I could get some lighter honey to sell, there just wasn't that much of a market for the darker honey.

Today, I'm an engineer designing phone offices... sometimes even in parts of the UK, though I've never traveled there. I can afford to purchase the equipment I choose to use and I can work on the genetics of the bees I manage. I've had Caucasian, Carniolan, Italian, and Buckfast bees as well as the black bees I started with. Today I have highly mite tolerant bees that are thriving and making a decent crop of honey with no interventions on my part. These bees are a mix with strong influence from the black bees, Italians, and the Russian mite tolerant bees brought in to Baton Rouge. I credit a major mite tolerance impact from the black bees which is interesting since they are susceptible to many other diseases and pests. The traits they carry are associated with grooming and mite mauling.

There are plenty of opportunities to breed mite tolerance into the bees used in the U.K. How many people are actively selecting for mite tolerance? Have you considered ways to bring mite tolerance into existing breeding lines?

I won't add any subtle innuendo to this post, there is enough in this thread already.

 

[Finman]

.
In London City they speak 300 different languages. In Milton Keynes City Council prints information with 12 languages.

In Finland we we keep our mouth shut with 2 official languages..
.

 

[Gilberdyke John]

.
In London City they speak 300 different languages. In Milton Keynes City Council prints information with 12 languages.

In Finland we we keep our mouth shut with 2 official languages..
.

I've heard vodka is the basis of one of the languages. Whats the other?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Gibberish?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

.
In Finland we we keep our mouth shut with 2 official languages..
.

I find the first part hard to believe

 

[Finman]

I've heard vodka is the basis of one of the languages. Whats the other?

Hello all my alcoholic friends! We are in same boat! How are your livers!

 

[For want of a better word]

Yes, I'm familiar with hogs. Are you?

Yep we have them leading our country into a cesspit of disaster at the moment... bit like yours have since independence!!

The pigs that we have on our farm are a lot more tolerant of each other and have good manners!

Yeghes da

 

[B+.]

The pigs that we have on our farm are a lot more tolerant of each other and have good manners!

Its a pity that this tolerance is not evident very often on this forum. No matter who it is. No matter where they're from. We're all beekeepers (or interested in bees in some way). Even if you disagree, please don't let offensive people drag you down to their level.

 

[For want of a better word]

Its a pity that this tolerance is not evident very often on this forum. No matter who it is. No matter where they're from. We're all beekeepers (or interested in bees in some way). Even if you disagree, please don't let offensive people drag you down to their level.

Tis the Celtic in me that wants to fight back... and the genetic trait that seems to not allow fools to be suffered gladly!


Yeghes da

 

[B+.]

Tis the Celtic in me

I understand completely. However, IGNORE works much better

 

[For want of a better word]

I understand completely. However, IGNORE works much better

Good advice B+
Has Grayling man gone back home?

Yeghes da