Advice regarding extraction

[Zante]

At the moment my two colonies are quite strong, and most definitely wouldn't fit in the brood box alone. They have two supers, but one is fully capped, and the other is on its way.

I'm not ready to extract yet, but I'm not too happy with the idea of putting a third super on the hives, although I do have the boxes and the frames. I would need to get some foundation though.

Should I get extracting, maybe by crush and strain for this time around?
Make an effort and get an extractor? (Still need to buy furniture for the home although the essentials are there)
Just leave the supers on and extract all in september?

I have up to four or five supers per hive if needed, but I think that's going to be ridiculous...

 

[JWF]

Chuck another super on and beg/borrow or save up for an extractor.

As long as your honey isn't prone to crystallising you will be fine to wait.

 

[enrico]

Sort the frames so you have all the capped ones in one box and remove it, uncap with hot knife and let them drain into bucket, may take a few days, in a sealed room, i.e. no windows open, give wet frames back to bees who will sort out remains. Or......bite the bullet and get an extractor. If there are other beekeepers near you then go halves!
E

 

[Zante]

Sort the frames so you have all the capped ones in one box and remove it, uncap with hot knife and let them drain into bucket, may take a few days, in a sealed room, i.e. no windows open, give wet frames back to bees who will sort out remains. Or......bite the bullet and get an extractor. If there are other beekeepers near you then go halves!
E

I'm tempted to bite the bullet and get one with July's wages.
Thing is I wanted to go straight for a 9 frame radial. I have only 2 colonies now, but by themselves on the first year they already have two supers each, and it's likely the number of colonies will rise, especially since I have two more potential apiaries lined up.
A 9 frame would allow me to spin a super at a time.

This is what I was looking at:
http://www.mondoape.it/smelatura/smelatore-inox-radiale-manuale-per-9-favi.html
Tried putting it through google translate but it made a right mess of it.

 

[Anduril]

Is this one any good, 9 frame, cheaper and motorised with a drill. €375.41 ex vat http://www.giordaninox.it/eng/prodo...xtractor&pid=a8a89eea1bab308a5bf1310d6c94af0a

 

[Zante]

Nice one, thanks.

EDIT:
Hmm... dunno... on top of that I'd need to get the cage for the frames.
Turns out to be more or less the same price as the equivalent extractor as the other place I was looking at.

 

[madasafish]

On top of an extractor , you will need (at least) one settling tank...50kg is the biggest practical for one person - but not liftable by one person if near full.
You will need filters.

I prefer to use a hot air gun rather than an uncapping knife... FAR less mess. And easier on uneven combs.

I have a 4 frame manual extractor with attachable settling tank -
http://tinyurl.com/hccpaep

Works very well three lang supers in 30 -40 minutes each from bringing into kitchen full to taking it out empty.. (average 27 pounds of honey per super).

Mine was s/h 2 years old hardly used ebay collected.. for less than half current new price.. (Buy cheap in winter)

 

[linoleum bonypart]

You dont need a nine frame extractor with two hives lol

 

[Dadnlad]

Depends very much on if you have the capacity or willpower to be expanding your number of colonies in the near futuere

If you are likely to stick with 2/3/4 hives then you won't need a big extractor

Heatherbell have a 3 frame ss with no legs (tabletop?) for £135 - not much of an outlay and fine for 2 hives ?



Zante - didn't spot the Italian connection, p&p across the EU will no doubt bump up the price

 

[thenovice]

2 hives and telling him to buy a motorised extractor? I have 10 at the moment and would still find that an excessive suggestion. I bought a second hand plastic 4 frame one from thornes 3 years ago for £30 and will be extracting 5 supers and a national bb with it this weekend. the biggest job is the uncapping. shall we advise on an automated uncapping station as well?
As per enrico. in your climate, honey should just leak out in a bucket if a spinner is not at hand from friends. if you are serious about the hobby, splash out on a hobby spinner. That will cater for all your needs until the hobby can pay for a big volume one. if going the second hand route: stainless and plastic only. stay away from the older galvanised stuff as not sanitary.

 

[Gilberdyke John]

I'm tempted to bite the bullet and get one with July's wages.
Thing is I wanted to go straight for a 9 frame radial. I have only 2 colonies now, but by themselves on the first year they already have two supers each, and it's likely the number of colonies will rise, especially since I have two more potential apiaries lined up.
A 9 frame would allow me to spin a super at a time.

This is what I was looking at:
http://www.mondoape.it/smelatura/smelatore-inox-radiale-manuale-per-9-favi.html
Tried putting it through google translate but it made a right mess of it.

I'd suggest a smaller extractor until you actually need a bigger unit then either sell the small one or part exchange it.

 

[Anduril]

Couldn't see anyone telling Zante to buy an electric extractor on this thread!

 

[Zante]

I understand that a 9 frame radial might seem a bit over the top, but I can get one for €450 (Approx £396 now), while a tangential one for 3 frames will set me back €300 (approx £264 now).

How long is it going to take me to extract six supers of nine frames each with either?
Not a rhetorical question, I really need a way of evaluating whether the time saved is worth the extra €150.

 

[Zante]

In any case, saturday I'm going to the bee stuff shop (that is also a beek cooperative), I can ask about the chances of getting a second hand extractor from one of their members or whether they even rent out extractors.

 

[Anduril]

A radial 9 frame extraction multiplied by 6
A tangential 3 frame extraction, 3 multiplied by 6, to do both sides multiplied by 2
Radial 6 extractions
Tangential 36 extractions

 

[Zante]

A radial 9 frame extraction multiplied by 6
A tangential 3 frame extraction, 3 multiplied by 6, to do both sides multiplied by 2
Radial 6 extractions
Tangential 36 extractions

Ok, but how long does one extraction take?
First year here, so I'm not aware of the actual time, even ballpark.
Unfortunately my apprenticeship had to end before I saw any extraction for various reasons.
(also each frame would be three sides on a tangential, plus the time to turn them)

 

[madasafish]

I understand that a 9 frame radial might seem a bit over the top, but I can get one for €450 (Approx £396 now), while a tangential one for 3 frames will set me back €300 (approx £264 now).

How long is it going to take me to extract six supers of nine frames each with either?
Not a rhetorical question, I really need a way of evaluating whether the time saved is worth the extra €150.

I extracted one super of 10 frames using a handheld 4 frame extractor in under 40 minutes on Tuesday night. That includes removing it from hive, decapping, and spinning. And replacing on hive.

The spinning bit took about 15 -20 minutes.. It is tangential so that included moving frames around in extractor..

I have 8 hives and expect to extract 10-15 supers.. but gradually over July and not all at once.. Then I have to bottle them -19 bottles last night.

I did my research carefully as I needed an extractor to handle also Lang jumbo frames... With 8 hives I will never ever need an electric extractor unless we have a blinding spring and summer - twice in a lifetime event..

Of course, your local climate will be different and you may get 4 capped supers per hive and more. I don't and never will. No arable land here within a 5 mile radius..

 

[Zante]

I extracted one super of 10 frames using a handheld 4 frame extractor in under 40 minutes on Tuesday night. That includes removing it from hive, decapping, and spinning. And replacing on hive.

The spinning bit took about 15 -20 minutes.. It is tangential so that included moving frames around in extractor..

I have 8 hives and expect to extract 10-15 supers.. but gradually over July and not all at once.. Then I have to bottle them -19 bottles last night.

I did my research carefully as I needed an extractor to handle also Lang jumbo frames... With 8 hives I will never ever need an electric extractor unless we have a blinding spring and summer - twice in a lifetime event..

Of course, your local climate will be different and you may get 4 capped supers per hive and more. I don't and never will. No arable land here within a 5 mile radius..

Thank you for your figures.

That's the problem really I don't know my bees and the area in terms of forage well yet.

This year my bees have done what I perceive to be "very well". On sunday when I go and visit them I fully expect to have to put a third super each on them and I bought the nucs in April. That's drawing half a brood box and a super each (I had drawn combs for the second super fortunately). That'd be already six supers in their first year, and the number of colonies is going to up from next year (I'm planning to increase slowly until I reach the point where I don't want to put more effort in)

In terms of forage hives are in the countryside and the bees have access to lots of acacia, peaches just round the corner, sweet and horse chestnut, some lime, alianthus, lots of wild clematis, lots of blackberry, and alfalfa is fairly common fodder.
There are plenty of olive groves in the area and while olives are wind pollinated, there is a substantial amount of wildflowers growing between the trees.
I'm sure there's more around too.

I know it's like asking the length of a piece of string but I do need help with evaluating this.

Also, another question that just came to mind: Is it worth doing one big extract at the end of the season or is it better to extract two or three times? That too would influence the decision.
With one big extract there'd be less honey washed off the side of the extractor when cleaning...

 

[colinc]

I have a tangential 3 frame spins for 2-3 minutes per side. I am on ritecell plastic foundation so less likely to blow out than wax. On timings the spinning bit will be 6 times faster, 3-4 mins per super max with the 9 frame radial 40-50 mins due to having to spin both sides with the tangential.

Depends on the decapping process as that will be the same time for both processes.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[madasafish]

Also, another question that just came to mind: Is it worth doing one big extract at the end of the season or is it better to extract two or three times? That too would influence the decision.
With one big extract there'd be less honey washed off the side of the extractor when cleaning...

Think of the logistics:
One big extraction:

Gains: Saves cleaning up multiple times #

Losses: Repeated lifting of full supers in weekly inspections..Say 20kg each . On and off each hive.
Storage during extraction of full and empty supers and protection from bees.
Time taken to carry full supers to extraction point.
Large amount of storage required fro honey to settle.
Run out of empty supers unless you have 4? 5? per hive..(Think of the lifting!)
Extraction may take all day and be exhausting..


Several Extractions

Gains:
less storage, fewer supers needed. and smaller settling tanks
Work spread out so you can do some when you have spare time.
Easier to inspect hive with fewer full supers.

Losses:
More cleaning.
More handling .
If you need assistance, it will be required more than once.

You have to think through your personal logistics or how would you carry it, store and extract and settle honey in each case.

For me , it's simple. I don't have the space to do all at once, the strength to handle it, the money for the extra equipment. AND I hate moving heavy supers on a ladder when they are five high. And my hive stands would break under the weight....