Advice needed

[holedigger]

Hi all
I lost two hives to woodpecker last winter and was thinking about buying a swarm. But instead a swarm moved into a pile of supers i had wilst i was storing them elsewhere in late summer. I need some advise as to the best way to get them into a broad box in the spring. ie will they move up or down ? or should i alternate super and broad box frames in a broad box? Any thoughts would be welcome, thanks

 

[oliver90owner]

Using drawn comb? With stores? Bees move up. When queenie is up, insert Q/E and wait three weeks. Job done. Stores should be moved up by then and supers can then be used on top as required - as long as you don't have qualms about extracting honey from brooded frames. Beware if you store them next winter as wax moth prefer brooded frames.

First thing, though, is getting them through the winter. OMF? If so, plenty of top insulation and no top ventilation. Feed fondant later if required. Might be teaching granny how to suck eggs and apols if I am.

RAB

Welcome to the forum, btw.

 

[holedigger]

Thanks for the advice, i only have foundation in my broad box as when the woodpecker got in and the bees disappeard by the time i noticed there was alot of dead broad in the frames. I cut everything out and got read to start again. I have only had bees for two years so still very much a novice. Thanks

 

[oliver90owner]

In that case, I would probably leave the new brood box on the bottom until they start to draw the comb.

Depends on the strength of the colony and the weather really. An alternative would be to dummy out a lot of the deep box and place it on top, but I have all sorts of bits laying around which are usable for that purpose.

First job is to get them through the winter. Next year's expansion might be slow at first if the colony were to be weak. If very strong you could even shook swarm them to a new box for a varroa-free start to the season. Three or four days of a thymol treatment could get nearly all the phoretic mites, and culling the first capped brood would get almost all the rest. So several alternatives would be available, the best being dependent on factors at the time.

RAB

 

[holedigger]

From my limited experience the colony i have seem stronger than previous as they seem to be out on days when my old colonies wouldn't have been. There is good numbers and are still taking in pollen. I have spare super and brood boxes so i guess i'll just have to wait till march, april. I have fondant ready to feed but will wait maybe a couple of weeks before considering feeding as the seem to be feeding ok at the moment. Thanks again

 

[mbc]

From my limited experience the colony i have seem stronger than previous as they seem to be out on days when my old colonies wouldn't have been. There is good numbers and are still taking in pollen. I have spare super and brood boxes so i guess i'll just have to wait till march, april. I have fondant ready to feed but will wait maybe a couple of weeks before considering feeding as the seem to be feeding ok at the moment. Thanks again

If they need feeding, then I would suggest feeding them now would be better than leaving it for a few weeks. Feed stored in the combs is better for them than fondant on top.

 

[oliver90owner]

As mbc, if they need feeding, get on with it now. Their (at least two) shallows should be crammed with stores before they cluster for winter. 20kg of stores is a typical recommendtion for the winter and apart from the stores also being good insulation, it means less 'vain' space - as Finman would call it.

RAB

 

[holedigger]

Ok thanks! I'll put a 2.5kg pack in as soon as the rain moves on. They do have stores but by the sound of it not enough. May the mild mild weather stay a little longer.

 

[Rosti]

Ditto what the guys are saying except I would put some fondant on as soon as I had finished feeding / it was too cold for them to take and process syrup. Reason for this three fold:
a) centralises the colony and with fondant above them reduces chances of isolation from stores and starvation (esp if unclear how much you have got into them)
b) continues to top up / supplement the syrup you have got in to them
c) gives you a monitor on 'reserves' later in the winter

Use an upturned Tupperware container or similar for the fondant and you can see what's been taken without disturbing / high heat loss.
Plenty of insulation around and above the fondant feeder (look up kingspan or Coatex or similar for insulation board). Good luck. R

 

[itma]

If they have drawn comb available in which to store it, I'd suggest feeding commercial invert syrup asap. They'll still take it down if they have somewhere to put it!
By all means put on fondant, later.
Best way for that is to put it direct onto the topbars - not above the crownboard - and therefore to use a crownboard with no hole!
Problem there is that you have to get the fondant into a thin sheet to fit in the beespace, or else give them excess headroom (with an eke under the crownboard.
Kitchen tip for rolling out fondant - put it in a plastic freezer bag, (or between plastic sheets, then roll it.

2.5 kg of fondant? Sounds like bee-branded fondant.
While I consider special bee invert syrups to be excellent for fast and late feeding, as far as I can tell the branded fondants are just ... fondant! Buying a 12.5kg block of white Bako fondant from your local cake baker's shop is generally simpler, quicker and much cheaper - and equally good for the bees.

 

[itma]

... Feed stored in the combs is better for them than fondant on top.

 

[holedigger]

Yes there is drawn comb in the super above the brood so i will put fondant in today as i'm away for a holiday thursday. It seems that each bee keeper has different ways of doing things, but i guess it's a case of choosing what works for your bees. I was wondering about cake baking fondant so thanks for the tip. Thanks for all the advice and hopefully the winter won't be too cruel to us

 

[holedigger]

Brood box filling with honey.

So the bees made it through winter without much difficulty. I've put a brood box on and comb has been drawn on 5 frames but it looks like they are filling with honey. Some forums say if it gets honey bound the queen won't move up. Has anyone got any thoughts on this.

 

[BeeJayBee]

What is the current set up, brood box and how many shallows/supers?

 

[oliver90owner]

Insert Q/E when she is up and she won't (shouldn't) go down again.

Add supers as necessary when the bottom box is finished with, or even before if needed..

 

[holedigger]

What is the current set up, brood box and how many shallows/supers?

I caught a swarm in a super late last year so didn't want to move them into a brood as is was a small swarm. So I've got super, brood, q/e, super.