working layer hive

[beesleybees]

Hi guys,

I think i have a hive with a working layer. All brood capped as drone, pitter pattern laying and 2 or 3 eggs in cells. I could be a drone laying queen also but I cannot find her

anyway, Im going to shake them all out and remove the original hive so hopefully they will bg to get into other hives

If i put another occupied hive on the original site, will this cause too much disruption as i assume they will all try to get in this one hive

advice appreciated

 

[oliver90owner]

The good idea of smoking them well (before moving, or shaking them out) will encourage the bees to gorge on stores before being dumped with nowhere to go, was put on the forum recently. More likely to be accepted at another hive.

As you have already decided what you are going to do, carry on.

But I would think. Is it better to simply move the hive first (if placing another on the same position), and allow the flying bees to join the other hive (as in less than a crowd, all at the same time)? At that stage, the laying workers would be left in the old hive. I could then decide what to do when the dodgy hive is depleted.

 

[beesleybees]

The good idea of smoking them well (before moving, or shaking them out) will encourage the bees to gorge on stores before being dumped with nowhere to go, was put on the forum recently. More likely to be accepted at another hive.

As you have already decided what you are going to do, carry on.

But I would think. Is it better to simply move the hive first (if placing another on the same position), and allow the flying bees to join the other hive (as in less than a crowd, all at the same time)? At that stage, the laying workers would be left in the old hive. I could then decide what to do when the dodgy hive is depleted.

thanx for the reply.

once all the flyers have left the original hive, whats the best thing to do with the old brood frames as they still have capped drone cells. seems a waste just to bin them

 

[Norvic_chris]

And just to make it more complicated...!

That seems sound advice! Can I complicate things slightly with my situation of 2 dwindling hives, one with laying workers, the other with no apparent laying activity at all, both resulting from an artificial swarm done in early May.

My plan, as above, is to allow bees from laying worker hive to join with the other hive, which is stronger and has plenty of stores but is by no means full of bees (because there's been no laying for too long). Then I was going to put in a frame of eggs/brood from my nicely expanding 3rd hive (from a recent swarm, now on 8 frames) to see if they will produce their own queen.

My aim is to go into winter with 2 strong hives so my question is whether this is the best approach or if it would simply be better to allow the weak hives to dwindle and to allow my third healthy hive to reach full strength and then make a split from that rather than remove a brood frame from it to kick start the dwindling hive.

I hope I've explained that clearly! All wise advice welcomed!

 

[oliver90owner]

Your coice. I know not what they are like, how long they have been used like that, how many there are, whether it is a DLQ or laying workers (might make a difference) or anything much, really.

Could freeze to kill and put them in a hive for the bees to clear out; you could scrape back to the midrib, it might be simpler to feed to the birds. Dumping it might be another choice, but I always recycle my frames.

Don't suppose, for one minute, all the frames are badly affected. Just be sensible and go with what attention you consider they deserve , on merit, after inspecting.

 

[oliver90owner]

Then I was going to put in a frame of eggs/brood from my nicely expanding 3rd hive

I hate advising using emergency cells. Much better to give them a good cell produced under the supercedure impulse. It would work, but the possibility of late season supercedure is greater, for a start.

You could split some of your open brood frames into another brood and place above the super, or two. They will hopefully draw a couple queen cells up there, away from the queen pheromone. A much better plan IMO.

The test frame should not be omitted as there may be a virgin queen in there.

If short of colonies, it would be better to utilise as many of the bees as possible, so leaving failing colonies (for the want of a new queen) to dwindle is a bit wasteful on resources.

Adding frames of emerging brood is a good boost to a weak colony.

Lots of alternatives that need thinking about. List all your altenatives and pick one that will work for you on paper. If it doesn't work on a paper plan, it likely won't work in practice.

 

[Norvic_chris]

Thank you O90O, as it's just started to rain here I've got a little extra time to sit down with pencil and paper and do exactly as you advise! Only my third Summer with bees and already I realise there is no single or 'always correct' answer! I hadn't thought of the drawbacks of using emergency queens, only that it might solve the problem in the short term. Chris

 

[Finman]

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You have 3 hives. Take brood off and shake the bees in front of next door hive.

 

[Norvic_chris]

Hi Finman -- that seems a good and easy solution but will this allow the laying workers to get into the hive too (which doesn't have a queen I think), which is why I was going to move the hive away? I don't really want to mix these bees up with the hive with 'good' colony just in case they've got weak because of disease (though I can't see any).

 

[beesleybees]

Hi Finman -- that seems a good and easy solution but will this allow the laying workers to get into the hive too (which doesn't have a queen I think), which is why I was going to move the hive away? I don't really want to mix these bees up with the hive with 'good' colony just in case they've got weak because of disease (though I can't see any).

Norvic, dont want to sound too harsh but this Is why you shouldnt jump in on someone elses thread, it just complicates things!! im not too sure if finman is talking to me or you now but I assume its me!!! or is it you doh!!!

 

[Norvic_chris]

Norvic, dont want to sound too harsh but this Is why you shouldnt jump in on someone elses thread, it just complicates things!! im not too sure if finman is talking to me or you now but I assume its me!!! or is it you doh!!!

Hi Beesley -- fair point! Had not intended to make it sooooo complicated!!

 

[beesleybees]

Hi Beesley -- fair point! Had not intended to make it sooooo complicated!!

no worries mate but just start up your own thread next time, makes things so much simpler.lol