What did I do wrong?

[Mandeville]

For future reference, I'd appreciate comments on what I did.

My first colony was a very small swarm which was collected last August Bank holiday and given to me in a five-frame nuc which included a couple of wet super frames.

I gave them syrup and fondant, and kept them warm and generally coddled them, and they came through the winter.

At the end of March they seemed to be thriving and had pretty much filled all the space in the nuc with stores and brood. I transferred them into a standard brood box in a WBC and gave them another 4 frames of foundation.

I then went on holiday, came back mid April.

19/04 Almost filled everything, so I gave them another frame in the brood box and put a super on. (My other colony had almost filled a super while I'd been away, so I though this lot might need more space)

29/04 Little change, they hadn't touched the super. Only a few eggs and larvae seen.

04/05 Still hadn't touched the super. No eggs seen, just a small amount of larvae and 1 open queen cell with larva.
As there was only one and it looked as if the queen had stopped laying, I thought this might be supercedure - altho' it was about 1/3 of the way up the frame, so not classic.

06/05 They swarmed!

Why did this happen? They had plenty of room - was this the problem? Too much space??


10/05 QC is capped and looks good. The bees were decidedly irritable during the inspection.

It has been suggested that I should remove the super for now until the new queen gets going.

The only other thing that I haven't mentioned is that when I came back from holiday I noticed that they were getting out of the hive at the back - the OMF wasn't fitting properly. I tried several strategies to stop this, and it took a few days before I found one that worked.

Sorry this is such a long post, but if anyone has made it through this far and can offer some advice on what I've done, I'd be really grateful.

Thanks
Mandy

 

[deb]

bees will be bees

Hi Mandy

I've had a similar thing happen. I'm a newbeek and got my first nuc quite late in the season last year. They were a strong colony, but I soon spotted that they were queenless. I re-queened successfully, but they went into the winter without much in the way of stores, so I fed them constantly 'til autumn, then left them with some fondant. I gave them fondant again in Feb.

They made it through and were doing very well in this early fine spring. I noticed queen cups appearing in mid April, but hoped that, as they were still not a large colony that I could deter them from swarming by taking off queen cups and giving them an extra super for brood.

They filled the addtional super with honey, and never seemed serious about using it for brood. Continued making queen cups and the queen was laying less.

We decided they were determined and we needed to divide the colony. New hive arrived and first opportunity to do it was yesterday.

Within a week since our last inspection they'd made and capped three queen queen cells and there was no sign of the queen, no eggs and less bees. We think they'd gone the day before. Just missed them.

I'm going a very long way round to telling you that I don't think you did anything wrong. They were determined and there's nothing you can do about it. There have been loads of swarms and I think it's the early fine weather has filled them with confidence to spread themselves around with so much of the season in front of them.

I'm anxious that a new queen will successfully hatch, mate and start laying now. Just got to trust that they know what they're doing.

Good luck with getting a new queen yourself. I'd be very interested to hear how you get on.

Best wishes
Deb

 

[oliver90owner]

My first colony was a very small swarm which was collected last August Bank holiday

That may be something to do with it. Swarmy bees, just got big enough to go again?

Put it down to the bees and requeen from your other colony at the earliest opportunity (and probably not a frame of eggs now!).

Regards, RAB

 

[CB008]

I had a small colony from a NUC which I got at the end of last season. I overwintered on 6 frames. They then went from 6 frames to swarming within 14 days. Perhaps the mega hot April just confused them. In any case, they definitely do not always read the books.

 

[Mandeville]

Thanks everyone for the reassurance that there was nothing I could have done.

Requeening from the other colony would be ideal - they're a really nice good-tempered lot. But unfortunately, I'm in limbo with them as well at the moment - they swarmed the day after I got back from holiday!! That's just over 3 weeks ago now and there were loads of QCs when I inspected, so I left a couple.

And then about 10 days ago, they had two aborted attempts at swarming. Since then they've settled down - but that may be because they did throw a cast that I didn't see. I saw a queen in there 2 days ago, but she's not laying yet. But there are no QCs now, so I've just got to keep my fingers crossed ....

 

[Poly Hive]

I'm with Rab on this one. Re-queen.

Also good advice to take of the super as they sure are not going to use it as the colony is currently going backwards, as in bees dying and not many being laid in replacement.

PH

 

[Hebeegeebee]

In my view, firstly Mandeville, leaving 2 queencells is asking for a cast!


I have had a couple of colonies that got through the winter fine; then the queens seemed to just give up in April. One stopped laying enough for long enough that I thought her dissappeard, raised some grafted queens in there, then she appeared again and started laying for a while before stopping. So now re-queened. (Very odd, that's not supposed to happen).

What happened is that the queen was present, no queencells, no laying. No reason to swarm due to lack of space. Another colony that didn't really get going tried to supercede early for 2 weeks in a row (I cut out the queencell as there were no drones about). They then stopped trying to supercede; the queen went iffy a while later - little brood and in and out of lay and I removed her after a couple of queencells appeared. One queencell is due to emerge soon.

I think deb and mandeville are highlighting what is perhaps a modern queen mating problem and illustrates why one hive is not enough.

 

[Mandeville]

Further thoughts about requeening

I said I couldn't get a queen from my other colony, but I may have an alternative source.

If I can get a queen, do I simply destroy the QC in the hive and introduce the new queen straight away because they already think they're queenless? Or should I leave it 24 hours as you would if you'd removed an existing queen?

And the other queen that I may be able to use is very new and I'm not sure if she's laying yet. Presumably it would be best to wait until I've seen that she is mated and laying?

@Hebeegeebee - I don't know that the other colony threw a cast, but I take your point. Leaving 2 QC was probably a symptom of a new beek's lack of confidence!

 

[Poly Hive]

I never leave two cells, and until this forum cannot say I have seen the advice given in books. I leave an open cell so I know there is a grub in it. That is that issue of viability sorted out.

Scrap your cell and yes leave them for 24 hours then begin the introduction.

PH