Taking a swarm on public footpath

[Chris B]

Yesterday as I left an apiary I encountered a GWB (gleaming white beekeeper) trying to coax a small swarm into a box. The bees were in the grass, almost certainly a clipped queen that couldn't fly any further and maybe 5000 bees. The loss didn't concern me but it would have if it had been a proper swarm. I lent my smoker to hasten the capture.
Question: the swarm was on private property but adjacent to a public footpath so the GWB wasn't trespassing, but permission had not been sought to capture it. Was the GWB in the wrong?

(Sorry to all you GWB's. I have to smile when I see pristine white bee suits, especially in groups of about a dozen and contrasted against my own sticky suit stained with propolis/sweat/blood/ink. I'm still waiting for the people who make Persil ads to come calling).

 

[enrico]

I too am the embarrassing man with the awful suit. I left my gloves in the garage and the mice eat the fingertips out so they are all repaired with duck tape. I packed my veil away for the winter in the shed but it got damp and has old water stains all over it which won't wash out and my suit looks like I've been painting orange all over the place. Still, I can't be accused of being a newbee!!!

 

[Midland Beek]

I suppose technically the beek was trespassing, ie. unathorised presence on private land. You will no doubt know that trespass is a civil matter and not a criminal one.

If it were me the law of trespass would not put me off collecting a swarm if it were on open-access private land, like farmland, for example.

 

[Foxylad]

Interesting, if there was a swarm in a beeks garden could i forgo the trespass law and just collect.

I think the beek would have something to say if i just told him " dont mind me im just trespassing"

 

[drstitson]

i suppose one should consider collecting swarms to be treated like foraging which one is free to do thanks to the theft act 1968.

(3)A person who picks mushrooms growing wild on any land, or who picks flowers, fruit or foliage from a plant growing wild on any land, does not (although not in possession of the land) steal what he picks, unless he does it for reward or for sale or other commercial purpose.
For purposes of this subsection “mushroom” includes any fungus, and “plant” includes any shrub or tree.

(4)Wild creatures, tamed or untamed, shall be regarded as property; but a person cannot steal a wild creature not tamed nor ordinarily kept in captivity, or the carcase of any such creature, unless either it has been reduced into possession by or on behalf of another person and possession of it has not since been lost or abandoned, or another person is in course of reducing it into possession.

so provided the owner of the bees is not present (hence the advice about finders keepers for swarms) one is free to collect "wild" bees from private property.

interestingly as soon as you start the process of collecting a swarm (i presume even going so far as to just from point of putting veil on) then it is yours even if it flies off and you have to give chase.

 

[greatbritishhoney]

If I found a GWB collecting a swarm on my private land he/she would be shown the exit rather promptly.
I'm not too bothered about the swarm but I'd be very unhappy about the trespass.

 

[Hombre]

I would be a bit concerned if the part of the public path was deep inside the private land.Was GWB stalking the bees and in the habit of frequenting the paths in the hope of encountering such a swarm, knowing of the presence of apiaries on the property?

If well off the beaten track then perhaps advised by another walker, but it does raise a few questions.

 

[stilllearning]

I've had a nice sparkely new skep within twenty feet of one of my sites a few years ago with a swarm (more than likely mine) in it. at first i thought "bloody cheek" then thought about going through it and taking out the queen but in the end i couldn't be bothered. would have been nice (considerate) just to leave a note or number saying is it ok, do you mind,I'll give you something, whatever, if he/she had done that i would have said "thats fine". it was my fault should have gone through them earlier, but its not what I would do, and i think thats the most annoying thing about it.
bees can do funny things but theres nowt as queer as folk

 

[Andre cardona]

I suppose technically the beek was trespassing, ie. unathorised presence on private land. You will no doubt know that trespass is a civil matter and not a criminal one.

If it were me the law of trespass would not put me off collecting a swarm if it were on open-access private land, like farmland, for example.

as above but id id ask the farmer first and id be re homing the bees which i think is best for the bees do unto to others as you would have done to you

 

[stilllearning]

If it were me the law of trespass would not put me off collecting a swarm if it were on open-access private land, like farmland, for example.

and i bet you leave gates open as well... after all its not your problem if animals get out.
if it was your land and your bees, how your views would change

 

[susbees]

and i bet you leave gates open as well... after all its not your problem if animals get out.
if it was your land and your bees, how your views would change

Hmm. We fought (not very hard) the access land ticket for our top land and won. Rationale being that the only way to get off it without trespass onto private land was back the way they came. So must mean something.

Our apiary is fully fenced but the field it forms part of is also ours and is crossed by two public footpaths. It is possible that a beekeeper could bait the hedges or whatever with lemongrass etc and walk past nonchalantly til one day he spies a lonely swarm. Now would that be playing fair? Nope. Trespassing off the path? Almost certainly.

Seeking permission from the landowner surely must stand for something?

 

[bee ginnner]

I

If it were me the law of trespass would not put me off collecting a swarm if it were on open-access private land, like farmland, for example.

There is NO (open access private land ) unless it is open moor/heathland etc.you think you have the right of access everywhere but dont care about landowners rights at all.either everybody has rights or no one. i personally find the attitudes of some people twisted and exceedingly offensive.

 

[Silly Bee]

Excuse me, but the bees were on private property, the GWB wasn't.

 

[Pezza]

Hi Chris B,

Surely having a nice clean bee suit is just good beekeeping?!!

Pezza

 

[Chris B]

Hi Pezza,

Yes it might be clean in the morning but by the afternoon it's a mess. And some stains just don't come out with ordinary powder.

 

[MuswellMetro]

(Sorry to all you GWB's. I have to smile when I see pristine white bee suits, especially in groups of about a dozen and contrasted against my own sticky suit stained with propolis/sweat/blood/ink. I'm still waiting for the people who make Persil ads to come calling).

And i washed my best suit specially for the Hygienic bee Course at LASI, next time i will take my old one

 

[MuswellMetro]

And i washed my best suit specially for the Hygienic bee Course at LASI, next time i will take my old one

missed off, guess which one of the people in the photo is Chris

 

[RoseCottage]

Hmmm strange location for the suit to get dirty...I hope my bees don't do that to me...its gotta hurt!

Sam

 

[susbees]

missed off, guess which one of the people in the photo is Chris

Ha...we had a cleaner sort of suit on the Saturday

 

[Chris B]

Hmmm strange location for the suit to get dirty...I hope my bees don't do that to me...its gotta hurt!

Sam

Ah that was somebody else. I'm 2nd from right.