Queenless Swarm????

[alexandrahulme]

This afternoon I went to AS my hive - as I walked towards with my smoker in hand the bees began spilling like water out of the hive ...I was too late !
They settled on a nearby tree and having shook them into a box they are now waiting to be re-homed into a nuc (It was fairly small less than a football)

My issue is that the swarmed hive was still very active around the entrance and didnt seem to settle - indeed the swarm itself too a good 30 mins to collect itself into the cardboard box - then I found a small group of bees on the ground outside the old hive - blow me!! the queen (she was quite large so Im assuming its the old queen) in the middle of them - she wasnt marked and hadnt been clipped.

I lifted her and she crawled back into the old hive - but now Im worrying...
Does the swarm in the box have a queen ?
Does the old hive now have the old and new still in there?
What shall I do with the swarm if there is no queen?

The longer I do this the more confused I get!
Any guidance and support really appreciated ...
Alex

 

[enrico]

If the queen in the box have no queen the chances are they will return to the original hive ..... And then off they will all go again!

 

[alexandrahulme]

oh bugger! Then what shall I do? I was just about to collect the cardboard box with the swarm from next doors garden and drop into a nuc.

 

[enrico]

It is a risk you take. I would give it a go as you have nothing to lose. Put the box of bees in a nuc nd go throught the old hive as you know the queen is there you may as well see what is going on. Check for queen cells. If you have one then you could always try adding that fame to the nuc. They may stay......I am trying to think outside the box here as what has happened is not usual!! Hoping someone else may come up with a good idea! I can only tell you what I would try in your circumstances!
Best of luck
E

 

[alexandrahulme]

Thanks I really appreciate your thoughts...

Just been to collect the cardboard box with swarm - Nothing!!!
Must have realised Q- and gone back to original hive
Ive just been intothe orignal hive with the intention of AS but cannot find the Q (Like you said I know at least shes there.
There are about 7 Q cells mostly sealed - I think I spyed at east 1 where the Q had obviously emerged. Im going to go back in early tomororw - hopefully before the swarm again!! and try and AS with the old Q.
There were loads of drones
Not much laying space and no eggs that I could see - looks like she stopped laying about 5 days ago...

 

[Mike a]

Inspect the hive, if you have queen cells A/S them by taking the queen out along with 1-2 frames of stores into a nuc and top up with drawn frames if you have them and plenty more frames worth of bees. Some of these bees will return to the parent hive so I generally shake in half the number of frames covered with bees. Then replace the missing frames.

As for the queen cells, I prefer to leave two cells of different sizes, if they are unsealed (preferred) I look for the two with the most royal jelly and big fat grubs and remove the rest. By doing that if the first queen fails then the second should emerge a day later.

Your colony by the sounds of it want to swarm if they haven't already again today, so you may need to manage them as soon as you can and not leave it to swarm when they want to as they may well go without you realising.

 

[alexandrahulme]

Thx Mike and Enrico

I've had enough today ( already A/S another of my hives this morning !) going to take our advice mike and try and find the Q and A/S first thing in the morning ... Shattered!!!

Time for a VERY large glass of red !!!

Thx again !

 

[Finman]

.
The swarm propably returns to home because they have not queen.

And then it swarms again.

.

 

[alexandrahulme]

Tack sa mycket Mr Finland

Yes Im afraid that's exactly what has happened ... So it will be like 'ground hog day ' for me tomorrow :-D

 

[Finman]

Tack sa mycket Mr Finland

Yes Im afraid that's exactly what has happened ... So it will be like 'ground hog day ' for me tomorrow :-D

jag inte snarka svenska

make a false swarm tomorrow if not the swarm is not allready at the tree top a'clock 9:00