Queen cell found - what to do?

[welshgirl]

Hi

I inspected a hive yesterday prior to treating with Apiguard and found a queen cell. I also found the queen (who is from this year), along with eggs, larvae, stores etc and apart from a high wasp presence, for which I have placed traps and reduced the entrance everything else appears "normal", although the brood amount is decreasing from earlier in the year.

So, what do I do now about the qc and about treating with Apiguard. As for the wasps - will moving the hive work?

Thanks

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Only one queen cell? is it capped, or open with a larvae resident.
My feeling is it's supersedure, I'd leave it run its course and delay apiguard for a while again.

 

[Finman]

.
Buy a laying Queen. Bees will change the Queen.

 

[Cussword]

Only one queen cell? is it capped, or open with a larvae resident.
My feeling is it's supersedure, I'd leave it run its course and delay apiguard for a while again.

 

[enrico]

The apiguard may deter the wasps a little. As for the queen cell, personally I would leave it!
E

 

[itma]

Hi

I inspected a hive yesterday prior to treating with Apiguard and found a queen cell. I also found the queen (who is from this year), along with eggs, larvae, stores etc and apart from a high wasp presence, for which I have placed traps and reduced the entrance everything else appears "normal", although the brood amount is decreasing from earlier in the year.

So, what do I do now about the qc and about treating with Apiguard. As for the wasps - will moving the hive work?

Thanks

1/ Brood normally reduces through Autumn (but not necessarily smoothly.)

2/ QC is very likely supercedure.
See the Welsh QC booklet http://beekeepingforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=28463
You could let it run, or to hedge your bets, let it run but take out old Q with a small nuc to preserve her just in case (and with a wasp problem, maybe best take her nuc a few miles away). Once new Q is laying worker brood, you could terminate old Q and re-unite the nuc with the main colony. If she fails, you could reunite around the old Q for the winter.
Since new Q proving good or bad would likely be a month away, it'd be getting late to start Apiguard. Probably better to plan for using something else IF there is a varroa problem demanding attention. (Check!) Anyway, you have a while to consider your treatment options.

3/ Wasps. Moving the hive. Less than 3 feet won't make much difference. More than 3 miles might.
You can reduce the entrance right down to a single fingerhole if needs be. Searching out the wasp nest might be another possible means of 'defence'.

 

[B+.]

Hi

I inspected a hive yesterday prior to treating with Apiguard and found a queen cell. I also found the queen (who is from this year), along with eggs, larvae, stores etc and apart from a high wasp presence, for which I have placed traps and reduced the entrance everything else appears "normal", although the brood amount is decreasing from earlier in the year.

So, what do I do now about the qc and about treating with Apiguard. As for the wasps - will moving the hive work?

Thanks

OK. I'm going against the grain again but, IMHO, you have a current season laying queen with plenty of brood in all stages. I'd destroy the queen cell. I've seen and heard of a lot of people introducing new queens and the first thing the colony seems to do is raise a supercedure cell. Its too late in the year to be waiting for a new queen to mate

 

[itma]

... I've seen and heard of a lot of people introducing new queens and the first thing the colony seems to do is raise a supercedure cell

I've seen that myself, but there's nothing posted to indicate that THIS Q is newly introduced ... !

 

[B+.]

I've seen that myself, but there's nothing posted to indicate that THIS Q is newly introduced ... !

Agreed. The queen is from this year though. I'd be extremely suprised if she was poorly mated and running out of steam already

 

[Erichalfbee]

I'd be extremely suprised if she was poorly mated and running out of steam already
In this part of Wales out of four ASs this year I have one drone layer, two failed and one only just started laying 6/7 weeks after emergence; brood to be evaluated next week........so I think it might well be possible

 

[mbc]

OK. I'm going against the grain again but, IMHO, you have a current season laying queen with plenty of brood in all stages. I'd destroy the queen cell. I've seen and heard of a lot of people introducing new queens and the first thing the colony seems to do is raise a supercedure cell. Its too late in the year to be waiting for a new queen to mate

Terrible choice imho, either destroy cell and queen and introduce another laying queen as Finman suggests or leave to get on with it as the others, why destroy a supercedure cell? Daft.
I'd also personally go ahead and treat, the virgin will emerge into a thymoly environment but the smell should have largely dissipated to by the time she needs to get back after a mating flight. It's worked for me in the past, supercedure cells sometimes dissappear, unfortunately varroa don't tend to without some help.

 

[B+.]

either destroy cell and queen and introduce another laying queen as Finman suggests

Not at all. I do it all the time.
I imported a fantastic drone mother and the colony promptly made 5 supercedure cells with the first eggs she laid. The queen is fantastic breeding stock and they wanted to supercede her!
If she really is failing, introducing a mated queen is a possible solution but I doubt she is failing. I also don't like the idea of leaving her to open mate if/when she emerges. I've had my fill of nasty stingy colonies over the years and I won't tolerate them now. Just ask Obee1 what its like trying to manage a nasty colony!

 

[mbc]

Not at all. I do it all the time.
I imported a fantastic drone mother and the colony promptly made 5 supercedure cells with the first eggs she laid. The queen is fantastic breeding stock and they wanted to supercede her!
If she really is failing, introducing a mated queen is a possible solution but I doubt she is failing. I also don't like the idea of leaving her to open mate if/when she emerges. I've had my fill of nasty stingy colonies over the years and I won't tolerate them now. Just ask Obee1 what its like trying to manage a nasty colony!

And your situation with a recently introduced breeder producing supercedure cells is relevant to the op's situation with an established queen producing an autum cell in what sense?

 

[B+.]

In this part of Wales out of four ASs this year I have one drone layer, two failed and one only just started laying 6/7 weeks after emergence; brood to be evaluated next week........so I think it might well be possible

OK. I'd be prepared to accept that sort of local knowledge...but, if that was true, the only viable solution would be to buy in a mated queen. Leaving a supercedure cell to mate would be the wrong choice, particularly for someone with only a few colonies.
I think it all depends on the true condition of the queen the OP has now. If she's laying well, destroy the cell

 

[B+.]

And your situation with a recently introduced breeder producing supercedure cells is relevant to the op's situation with an established queen producing an autum cell in what sense?

Its a mature (red - 2 year old) queen
My point being that you sometimes have to intervene and stop the bees from superceding a good queen.

 

[mbc]

Its a mature (red - 2 year old) queen
My point being that you sometimes have to intervene and stop the bees from superceding a good queen.

Entirely up to you, but don't be surprised if people point out your advice might be unwise to a beekeeper posting a question about an entirely different situation.

 

[B+.]

might be unwise to a beekeeper posting a question about an entirely different situation.

I don't think it is too dissimilar. If anything they're more likely to supercede an older queen. As I said in response to Ericas post, if the queen is still laying, why take the risk of allowing supercedure now?

I can't see this queen being more than 3 months old. Each drone produces more than enough semen to inseminate the queen for its entire life. Even in the worst case scenario of a single drone mating, she should be fertile for a long time to come.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

exactly how much of a risk? - It's only the end of August, shedloads of drones about, bees still gong full pelt and personally I have not had any issues with open mated queens around here. Some of us are happy to have a good mix of local genes in our bees.
Although I must admit I do buy in the occasional non local mated queen - from Cardigan

 

[B+.]

It's only the end of August, shedloads of drones about, bees still gong full pelt and personally I have not had any issues with open mated queens around here.

So, whats wrong with the queen thats laying in there now? If the brood pattern is alright, why replace her?

 

[mbc]

So, whats wrong with the queen thats laying in there now? If the brood pattern is alright, why replace her?

Because her bees seem to think it's necessary.
Leaving a supercedure cell doesn't necessarily mean the demise of the currently laying queen anyway.