No money in honey now

[ericbeaumont]

the UK is not self sufficient in Honey production... UK manufacturers [ie us] not agreeing on a minimum price per oz/lb of our product.

If manuka has done us a favour by raising the perceived price-point of real honey, then beekeepers ought to capitalise on it. What this means in practice is that every BKA and beekeeper should persuade, cajole and explain to other beekeepers why it's important to raise the value and price of honey collectively, and that those that undervalue their crop and sell at giveaway prices undermine those who value it and sell at proper prices. Even if the former raised at 10p every other year, such an increase in outlying areas is likely to be accepted.

We import about 88% of UK honey; tradition has it that variable weather and fragmented forage prevent vast yields. That doesn't mean that our niche crop should be priced at the level of processed imports, which is what too many beekeepers seem happy to achieve.

Forget the supermarkets: they're not going to join in.

 

[Murox]

All the more bizarre when you consider that most are uninfluenced by commercial ownership.

 

[ericbeaumont]

All the more bizarre when you consider that most are uninfluenced by commercial ownership.

Yes; the big suppliers (UK or global) are tied like Gulliver to world honey market prices, which hover around £3/lb. The small-scale UK honey producers (with two, or two hundred hives) are free to market and price as they see fit. The job we have to do is persuade beekeepers to see the difference in value of the two entirely different products, and price accordingly.

Another job would be to persuade more to take up beekeeping and make a career of it. The BFA have an apprenticeship scheme, which is a start in the right direction, but bear in mind that too many young people are petrified of getting their hands dirty by engaging with nature, and would laugh if you suggested beekeeping as a source of employment. The not-for-profit Golden Company in East London set out about ten years ago to challenge that by turning young people into beekeepers and entrepreneurs: what a brilliant plan! Last year, however, I heard that the company had closed; story was that they couldn't persuade enough young people to learn an uncomfortable trade.

 

[Ian123]

Methinks we won't be importing much Chinese honey over the next couple of years. Unless they can filter it to guarantee it's virus-free (I mean really filter it, not just apply a sticker saying they have filtered it).

Lol I think the majority are aware that a viruses can’t be transferred in such a way!!!! Secondly it’s not really advertised as Chinese....Normally along the line of..product of EU and none EU countries just to throw you off.

 

[For want of a better word]

ENGLISH Bulk honey prices in 2018 £3.10 to £3.25 lb
in 2020 £3.25 to £3.65 lb ( £7.16kg to £8.04kg)... from this months issue of Beefarmer (Vol 6 issue 1)

 

[Hachi]

If manuka has done us a favour by raising the perceived price-point of real honey, then beekeepers ought to capitalise on it. What this means in practice is that every BKA and beekeeper should persuade, cajole and explain to other beekeepers why it's important to raise the value and price of honey collectively, and that those that undervalue their crop and sell at giveaway prices undermine those who value it and sell at proper prices. Even if the former raised at 10p every other year, such an increase in outlying areas is likely to be accepted.

We import about 88% of UK honey; tradition has it that variable weather and fragmented forage prevent vast yields. That doesn't mean that our niche crop should be priced at the level of processed imports, which is what too many beekeepers seem happy to achieve.

Forget the supermarkets: they're not going to join in.

Totally agree. Some Assoc I've been in set the price per pound every year that members should charge for their produce.

 

[citrus]

If manuka has done us a favour by raising the perceived price-point of real honey, then beekeepers ought to capitalise on it. What this means in practice is that every BKA and beekeeper should persuade, cajole and explain to other beekeepers why it's important to raise the value and price of honey collectively, and that those that undervalue their crop and sell at giveaway prices undermine those who value it and sell at proper prices. Even if the former raised at 10p every other year, such an increase in outlying areas is likely to be accepted.

We import about 88% of UK honey; tradition has it that variable weather and fragmented forage prevent vast yields. That doesn't mean that our niche crop should be priced at the level of processed imports, which is what too many beekeepers seem happy to achieve.

Forget the supermarkets: they're not going to join in.

Totally agree Eric ...

Do we have any creatives to make a flier/campaign/facebook ad ... video of a tesco honey water test .. an image of manuka as the high water price etc

#buybritish etc

Need to get the message out to everyone tho ...I have access to a colour printer at work and could post out to all the BKA's from work ...and happy to do some legwork

 

[Curly green finger's]

Totally agree. Some Assoc I've been in set the price per pound every year that members should charge for their produce.

I also agree with Eric.. @ hachi this is a good question and has also been on my mind. I was wondering do association's in different regions charge different prices or is a collective agreement between associations agreed.
Is honey worth more or should it be worth more if you live in different parts of the country.

 

[ericbeaumont]

wondering do association's in different regions charge different prices or is a collective agreement between associations agreed. Is honey worth more or should it be worth more if you live in different parts of the country.

In an ideal world BKAs would exchange information and support each other, but in the real world...and no matter what a BKA recommends (they can't insist) the message will be rejected by some who prefer to live in the past.

Price levels vary, partly according to affluence, partly to historic customer expectations (retail or trade), and partly to the beekeeper fulfilling those expectations. The first (affluence) is misleading, because I have customers who are definitely not affluent but make choices based on authenticity of food source; they just eat less of it. Elsewhere old-school buyers expect to buy in 1lb jars at low prices, but the beekeeper has an opportunity to wean them away from that perception; it may take a bit of courage to step out of the established price range for an area, but if it's done incrementally it's less painful for both parties.

Recently I bumped up the price (£12/lb at market for five years) when the first bell heather was bottled; sold it at £14/lb, and 36 x 227g jars went in three hours; all they had to do was taste it. No-one commented on the price increase; luckily I've got another 200lbs. in buckets.

 

[For want of a better word]

In an ideal world BKAs would exchange information and support each other, but in the real world...and no matter what a BKA recommends (they can't insist) the message will be rejected by some who prefer to live in the past.

Price levels vary, partly according to affluence, partly to historic customer expectations (retail or trade), and partly to the beekeeper fulfilling those expectations. The first (affluence) is misleading, because I have customers who are definitely not affluent but make choices based on authenticity of food source; they just eat less of it. Elsewhere old-school buyers expect to buy in 1lb jars at low prices, but the beekeeper has an opportunity to wean them away from that perception; it may take a bit of courage to step out of the established price range for an area, but if it's done incrementally it's less painful for both parties.

Recently I bumped up the price (£12/lb at market for five years) when the first bell heather was bottled; sold it at £14/lb, and 36 x 227g jars went in three hours; all they had to do was taste it. No-one commented on the price increase; luckily I've got another 200lbs. in buckets.

Well done.

If anyone with an ounce of commercial sense... even the BKAs who seem to think they can dictate a seriously undervalued price....

Better to give up and invest in a carp fishery instead!

Yeghes da

 

[Hachi]

It isn't every assoc I've belonged to that set a price so no, its not across the board. It should be though so that we can all re-invest in our bee's that protects the future. Similarly, I only pay rent at the traditional amount, 1lb per hive per year. Out of respect to my fore fathers and so I don't affect those that will come after me. I've NEVER met a farmer or landowner who hasn't welcomed this rate once I've explained to them how it works.

 

[For want of a better word]

It isn't every assoc I've belonged to that set a price so no, its not across the board. It should be though so that we can all re-invest in our bee's that protects the future. Similarly, I only pay rent at the traditional amount, 1lb per hive per year. Out of respect to my fore fathers and so I don't affect those that will come after me. I've NEVER met a farmer or landowner who hasn't welcomed this rate once I've explained to them how it works.

Make it 1 lb per PRODUCTIVE hive......

 

[Hachi]

Make it 1 lb per PRODUCTIVE hive......

Not the farmers fault you're as tight as a mossy's chuff and can't manage your bee's.

 

[ericbeaumont]

Similarly, I only pay rent at the traditional amount, 1lb per hive per year. Out of respect to my fore fathers and so I don't affect those that will come after me. I've NEVER met a farmer or landowner who hasn't welcomed this rate once I've explained to them how it works.

Let's hope that continues, Hachi, but bear in mind that the rate evolved eons ago when honey was cheap; I wonder what the landowner would think if they knew that local honey was a valuable product. I've noticed occasionally in the last few years, when collecting swarms, that some have heard via the media that bees are seriously valuable, and are mildly surprised that they have to give me £30 to cover expenses.

 

[Ian123]

The old jar of honey per hive is a bit of a joke, decent sites are worth having and honey and a bottle or 6 of decent whiskey or plonk are the very least I would expect to part with.

 

[WoodenBeam]

Thoughts are that a jar of Honey shouldn’t be under valued..........well nor should the value of hives on farm land.
As I see it my presence on a farm is quite unique. Minimal impact or disturbance on the land and I bring with me loads of pollinators. The farmer has to do nothing & he/she gets some local Honey - in my view it really is a win win for everyone.
Now if you compare that to some of the horror stories you hear about in New Zealand with Honey Wars with people paying for siting of hives.........well what a crock of shite that is!
Bringing Europe in to the discussion.......they do have some sensible ideas, agricultural payment for hives on land I seem to remember from somewhere - now that’s an incentive but open to corruption I’m sure.
Then there’s also pollination contracts - in the extreme almonds but that is a hard job and hence the payment.
There is a balance to everything and I think the ‘jar/hive’ when taken into consideration alongside the pollinator value represents a sensible form of rent.
I would expect those with short term expectations to be happy to pay for the instant reward of selling their crop at £10/lb.......& then following a poor season buggering off to find another boom & bust market industry.
I think I’ll stick to plodding along enjoying the gratitude received for a few jars of local Honey to landowners & seeing the pleasure in customers returning for a second jar of delicious, reasonably priced Honey.

 

[For want of a better word]

Hachi

Drone

Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Wiltshire
Posts: 1,562
Users Country Flag
Hive Type: Commercial
Number Of Hives: 20+

Default
Quote:
Originally Posted by For want of a better word View Post
Make it 1 lb per PRODUCTIVE hive......
Not the farmers fault you're as tight as a mossy's chuff and can't manage
your bee's.

your bee's what.... did you mean your bees ( Plural of bee where we use English Grammar!!)

( Don't you just love a pedant!!)
By productive hive ... one in HONEY production......

When the farmers/ land owner sees 20 colonies sitting in his field he would not necessarily know in some circumstances that those colonies are being utilised for queen rearing.... I know for some a strange idea when one can obtain a looverly nice imported foreign non native for a mere £27 or so !!

What would the farmer do with 60 jars of honey, most do not want anything... for most a couple will do.. plus of course a few bottles of Tamnavulin or three!

Being as you so eloquently put it... as tight as a mossy's chuff ...must be a thing in your neck of the woods?

AND we are managing our Cornish Native black bees very well thank you!!

Chons da

 

[Hachi]

Let's hope that continues, Hachi, but bear in mind that the rate evolved eons ago when honey was cheap; I wonder what the landowner would think if they knew that local honey was a valuable product. I've noticed occasionally in the last few years, when collecting swarms, that some have heard via the media that bees are seriously valuable, and are mildly surprised that they have to give me £30 to cover expenses.

I know what you mean Eric, but from my perspective, they seem to like tradition and they like the service my bee's do. Adam from countryfile reckons having bee's on his farm increases yield by up to 15% . If this is true, farmers get a substantial return having beehives on their land. Also helps with their "eco friendly" credentials.

 

[Hachi]

Hachi

Drone

Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Wiltshire
Posts: 1,562
Users Country Flag
Hive Type: Commercial
Number Of Hives: 20+

Default
Quote:
Originally Posted by For want of a better word View Post
Make it 1 lb per PRODUCTIVE hive......
Not the farmers fault you're as tight as a mossy's chuff and can't manage
your bee's.

your bee's what.... did you mean your bees ( Plural of bee where we use English Grammar!!)

( Don't you just love a pedant!!)
By productive hive ... one in HONEY production......

When the farmers/ land owner sees 20 colonies sitting in his field he would not necessarily know in some circumstances that those colonies are being utilised for queen rearing.... I know for some a strange idea when one can obtain a looverly nice imported foreign non native for a mere £27 or so !!

What would the farmer do with 60 jars of honey, most do not want anything... for most a couple will do.. plus of course a few bottles of Tamnavulin or three!

Being as you so eloquently put it... as tight as a mossy's chuff ...must be a thing in your neck of the woods?

AND we are managing our Cornish Native black bees very well thank you!!

Chons da

Blah blah blah.

 

[For want of a better word]

Blah blah blah.

Get out of the wrong side of bed this morning?????

It's all baaa baaa baaa down here at the moment...... so may triplets!

Yeghes da