Making increase

[Show me the honey]

I followed wally shaw's booklet on making increase using emergency queen cells so I spilt my only hive on 03/06 check in around 10 days later and there were 5 capped cells I left them all as it's states they will pick. Im thinking by the 1/07 I should be good to go in and hopefully find eggs? Obviously I've lost a month so was thinking can I add a frame of brood from the parent colony to boost the split?

In hindsight next time I think I'll buy a mated queen or have something else planned a lot rides on them queens making it back!! But that's another post

Cheers all

 

[Quis Custodiet]

Generally you can give them a frame of emerging brood.... (the cells will be darker and the odd bee will be emerging). You will avoid a three week wait doing that, remember take the frame but not the bees.

 

[Millet]

I followed wally shaw's booklet on making increase using emergency queen cells so I spilt my only hive on 03/06 check in around 10 days later and there were 5 capped cells I left them all as it's states they will pick. Im thinking by the 1/07 I should be good to go in and hopefully find eggs? Obviously I've lost a month so was thinking can I add a frame of brood from the parent colony to boost the split?

In hindsight next time I think I'll buy a mated queen or have something else planned a lot rides on them queens making it back!! But that's another post

Cheers all

Bad move i would say, yes they will pick a virgin queen and maybe swarm with her and so on till you have next to no bees left, one or maybe two Queen cells left behind would have been a better option from my experiences.

 

[maddydog]

I don't do a 'wally' but did the colony that produced the QCs have all the brood and young bees? If so, they should be well stocked anyway. Saying that it, doesn't do any harm to add a frame of bias from a strong colony. If there isn't a mated queen in there then it will delay laying workers.
If she has mated successfully then I would be expect there to be eggs anytime now. Alot does depend on the weather though over the last week or so.
As you've found for yourself, there is a reason why buying in mated queens is popular

 

[maddydog]

Bad move i would say, yes they will pick a virgin queen and maybe swarm with her and so on till you have next to no bees left, one or maybe two Queen cells left behind would have been a better option from my experiences.

Unlikely in this scenario IMHO. The bees are looking to replace their missing queen, not reproduce/swarm

 

[Millet]

Unlikely in this scenario IMHO. The bees are looking to replace their missing queen, not reproduce/swarm

I only stated what i said from my experiences not what i have read in a book .

One of my hives superseded a 2015 Queen this year, i left two Queen cells,however i missed a well hidden third one, the first Virgin went of with a swarm, the other two fought it out with one looser that i found half dead, if i had left them with five Queen cells who knows what would have happened.

 

[Show me the honey]

Ok thanks so plan is inspect at the weekend or should I do it sooner really? Really not keen on the idea of laying workers!! What would be the time/trigger for that to start happening?

I like how simple the method is but next time I'll have a queen ready maybe one of my own see how I go this year!

 

[Millet]

Ok thanks so plan is inspect at the weekend or should I do it sooner really? Really not keen on the idea of laying workers!! What would be the time/trigger for that to start happening?

I like how simple the method is but next time I'll have a queen ready maybe one of my own see how I go this year!

I have had two laying worker colonies up to now fingers crossed i never see another, i doubt there is any time scale for a laying worker to take hold but what i have found with the strain of bees i have is once they get past the four week mark of being Queen less after failed attempts from Queen cells that is when the **** hits the fan.

Good luck and i hope you have better luck than me.

 

[Show me the honey]

I have had two laying worker colonies up to now fingers crossed i never see another, i doubt there is any time scale for a laying worker to take hold but what i have found with the strain of bees i have is once they get past the four week mark of being Queen less after failed attempts from Queen cells that is when the **** hits the fan.

Good luck and i hope you have better luck than me.

Thanks millet let's hope so! Theres old barn with lots of swift/swallows to the right of the hive maybe 300 yards away, any other way is woodland or fields. I was up there a few days ago watching them dart around thinking how lovely till I thought what if she flew that way!!

 

[taurus]

I followed Sally Shaw's method last year but didn't read the bit about not thinning out the emergency queen cells. With hindsight it was a mistake to thin them out as I probably destroyed the better cells. They raised a queen but superseded her almost immediately.

This year I'm doing the same method but not thinning the cells.

I was pointed to Ohio State University website where there is a handy Excel spreadsheet for queen rearing. You put in the date of the eggs and it works out a timetable to check progress. If I remember right it took mine towards 6 weeks before there were eggs present. Then they bumped her off.

 

[maddydog]

Ok thanks so plan is inspect at the weekend or should I do it sooner really? Really not keen on the idea of laying workers!! What would be the time/trigger for that to start happening?

I like how simple the method is but next time I'll have a queen ready maybe one of my own see how I go this year!

Inspect at the weekend as you'd originally planned. If there are no eggs then add a frame of bias from a strong colony. Just to be clear, it is the presence of bias (not the queen) that suppresses the onset of laying workers.A mated queen is merely the vehicle to provide the bias!
Nothing wrong with producing your own queens but I think there are better ways than this one, Demaree for one.

 

[Show me the honey]

Inspect at the weekend as you'd originally planned. If there are no eggs then add a frame of bias from a strong colony. Just to be clear, it is the presence of bias (not the queen) that suppresses the onset of laying workers.A mated queen is merely the vehicle to provide the bias!
Nothing wrong with producing your own queens but I think there are better ways than this one, Demaree for one.

Cheers for that Good to know and I will be looking to try a few different ways to see which ones I like!

 

[Show me the honey]

Update

Looked through the frames July 2nd no eggs (split on 3rd June) I put in a brood frame with BIAS as a test frame. I'd like to go in this weekend with a plan a,b and c!!!

My thinking

No emengercy queen cell and eggs = happy days
Queen cells = failed queen let them try again?
Queen cells = failed queen and get a mated queen?

If I decide to get a mated queen what do I do with the cells that will be in there it will be 7 days since they could start building any?

Thanks

 

[beesbeesbees]

Inspect at the weekend as you'd originally planned. If there are no eggs then add a frame of bias from a strong colony. Just to be clear, it is the presence of bias (not the queen) that suppresses the onset of laying workers.A mated queen is merely the vehicle to provide the bias!
Nothing wrong with producing your own queens but I think there are better ways than this one, Demaree for one.

Gotta be worried about bees and their bias(towards what)

 

[B+.]

If I decide to get a mated queen what do I do with the cells that will be in there it will be 7 days since they could start building any?

Destroy them. You've effectively made them "hopelessly queenless" (no eggs/larvae of a suitable age from which they could produce a queen). You don't want any challenger to the introduced queen.
Alternatively, you could cut them out and push the "heel" of the cell into comb in a nuc (be careful not to damage the cell). This is only really worth the effort if they are a nice strain you want to keep .....BUT...it's down to the drones she mates with. You've no way of knowing what you would get.

 

[Show me the honey]

Destroy them. You've effectively made them "hopelessly queenless" (no eggs/larvae of a suitable age from which they could produce a queen). You don't want any challenger to the introduced queen.
Alternatively, you could cut them out and push the "heel" of the cell into comb in a nuc (be careful not to damage the cell). This is only really worth the effort if they are a nice strain you want to keep .....BUT...it's down to the drones she mates with. You've no way of knowing what you would get.

Ideal thanks

Not got the spare drawn frames for a nuc as well, but I'll keep that in mind for next time! Just got to wait and see now

 

[Show me the honey]

I thought I'd add on to this so you all have to back story to hand. New queen arrived yesterday, and all the queen cells had been removed by a friend who was at the apiary and in all fairness should know what he's looking for (I thought!) but out of the 5 they made he missed one very small one, I will say it was very but there all the same it was still capped

I knocked it down and added the queen cage anyways with the cap still over the fondant will go back in a day or 2 and all being well take that off and let them go through the fondant and so on. Was that ok to do? I know with a queen they suggest 24 hours didn't know if it's different for queen cells?

Sorry for babbling on

 

[Millet]

I thought I'd add on to this so you all have to back story to hand. New queen arrived yesterday, and all the queen cells had been removed by a friend who was at the apiary and in all fairness should know what he's looking for (I thought!) but out of the 5 they made he missed one very small one, I will say it was very but there all the same it was still capped

I knocked it down and added the queen cage anyways with the cap still over the fondant will go back in a day or 2 and all being well take that off and let them go through the fondant and so on. Was that ok to do? I know with a queen they suggest 24 hours didn't know if it's different for queen cells?

Sorry for babbling on

Brilliant result and well spotted with that sneaky Queen cell, i have give up with trying to get Queens mated after five virgins have gone missing in action over the past two years, i will buy mated Queens in from now on as it gets things back on track much quicker than waiting for Queen cells to emerge and then run the gauntlet getting mated, the timing is good for you also as they will be able to build up nicely for winter.
You are not babbling on by the way you are keen and just want to let everyone you are doing good.