Langstroth size National Size

[ma1308]

I am still trying to decide between wood or a poly hive for next year, with MB having a sale at the moment I am leaning towards the poly Langstroth
could someone tell me is there much difference in size between the National and the Langstroth, if there is no real difference on size what are the differences

Thanks in advance.

 

[Skyhook]

There is a sticky on here with all the sizes, that should tell you.

 

[BBG]

If you can pick up a large brown bag of potatoes, you can easily pick up a Langstroth medium super but stagger a bit on a brood box perhaps.

Many Nationals are on brood and a half but a goodly few use other as does Oliver90Owner who will no doubt be here in a while.

 

[Black Comb]

Langstroth is slightly larger and has more brood cells. (72,000 c.f 57,000 - approx.)

Also L/S supers are larger so hold a a bit more (heavier of course)

national BB is 460 x 460 x 225mm o/d
L/S BB is 508 x 413 x 240mm o/d

If you do some more research you will see the advantages/disadvantages for both.

 

[ma1308]

Thanks for the quick replys I have now found the sticky with sizing on

 

[drstitson]

"L/S supers are larger"

LS supers are actually the shallowest you can get BUT most LS polys come with LS med for supers (ie dadant supers).

 

[Spadaman]

I have Nationals and my friend (who has 70+ hives) uses Langstroths. I have been helping him all of this year and so have experience of both.

In general I prefer the Nationals as the frames have much larger lugs than the Langstroths. This makes for handling the frames a lot easier, especially when you need to hold it with one hand. I find I have to hold the side of the frame and the lug when one handed. The National boxes also have a lovely long handle to grip - especially appreciated when lifting a full super - the Langstroths have a handle cut out of the sides and is far less usefull. You do get used to them after a while and it's not really a big issue - but it is nice when I go back to my Nationals and the big hand holds !

One thing I would say is that a standard BS National Brood box would quite often not be big enough for a strong colony and 14x12 BB would be better. Obviously, this depends on the colony build up rate during the spring.

The Langstoth supers are heavy when full - I did 6-7 hrs of lugging supers about yesterday and I was totally knackered afterwards.

National gear is a lot easier to source than Langstroth although Langstroth is easier to make (DIY). Not sure about plastic / poly hives - I am sure there are a lot of advantages (like lightness) but my main concern would be their robustness under the hive tool. Cracking crown boards/supers after they have been glued down; scaping off propolis etc. Would plastic take this sort of bashing? I am sure there are plenty of beeks here that would tell you more about plastic.

Hope this helps.

 

[Black Comb]

L/s super frames are bigger than the national overall - 448 x 137mm c.f. 356 x 140mm so as the good doc says they are shallower (by 3mm). A full super is heavier though.

The sizes are all for wooden hives, poly hives are thicker and the o/d are different. It is not so easy to mix and match poly and wood components.

As you may already have found, L/s sizes do vary slightly from country to country.

 

[Poly Hive]

Sorry but I have to laugh here.

I have mixed and matched timber and poly for near 25 years with no issues so what is the alleged problem? You have to be a little careful in the alignment but that holds true for adding timber supers too.

Lugs on Nationals I frankly detest, they are clumsy for me. I far prefer Langstroth and Smith type frames.

Hand holds. On timber Lang yes they are a bit small for the weight where as the Nats have a good grip.

Given my choice though I would go for Poly Lang over timber Nats every time.

I am using poly Nats for the simple reason I am selling nucs and it saves the compatibility issues.

PH

 

[Black Comb]

Given that the OP is talking about MB poly (which has that "lip") I stand by my experience with both and say it is not so easy to mix and match poly and wood components. It can be done though.

 

[oliver90owner]

talking about MB poly (which has that "lip")

I can't imagine there would be many wanting to use poly supers on timber hives. I will be better armed to comment when I have over-wintered a colony in the poly National, but at the moment it is still in a box. A small 'lip', if not needed is easily removed, I am sure.

As far as I see it the wintering attributes are a strong point. The reports of extra crop are interesting, too, but whether that is down to poly-supers, or not, might be a debatable topic (well at least after the first super....).

RAB

 

[David P]

and as a by the by the MB polys have a lovely deep handle on all sides so much easier than thos nasty wooden nats with you have to pick up from the same two sides.

 

[Poly Hive]

I agree it is not so easy as it should be because of that lip, which in my view is a serious design error.

However as I do not posess any of them and nor am I going to buy any then for me it is not an issue at all.

However I insist that it is more than possible to mix and match poly and wood a wee matter that a certain company at Stoneleigh were saying was not possible. Tosh!

PH