I need a bit of Counselling

[MuswellMetro]

Dear Agony Aunts on the forum

Saturday I looked at an abandoned apiary with our chairman becasue a husband and wife team are giving up as they feel they can no longer devote enough time to bee keeping because they no have a young child

last spring , they had eight colonies in an urban apiary on 14x12s but by Saturday they had two strong colonies with two weaker colonies defending from wasps ,all a bit light on stores

A further three dead outs were all open and not sealed (one only just succumbed..a total free for all, with wasps being ignored by the robbing bees in the rush for honey)

They also had three dartingtons slowly rotting at the back of the apiary

The colonies on 14x12 have not been fed at all and this summer no supers were put on or honey taken off., ok easy i can just slap on a 12.5k box of bakers fondant

They can stay at the apiary and they will give the association the bees but they want to remove and keep all theirs supers and boxes

I wish they had asked for help before as now we've now got to work out what to do with them, it is too late for apiguard here and the weather is forecast to get much colder by the week end

The last varroa treatment appears to be a tub of apiguard put on in September 2011 ,We couldn't monitor but i expect the varroa and virus load is very high and some may not last till oxalic in January.

I also don't know whether bayvarol will work that effectively as we had varroa resistant mites last time we checked .They say they will put Bayvarol on and transfer them to some of our 14x12 boxes that we reserved for pagden swarm control

I really don't know if it is worth trying to save this varroa infested stock as we will need to replace our swarm boxes/roofs/floors then buy more (say two) for pagden swarm control of these four colonies....then how many super, perhaps an extra dozen needed

signed

Depressed of Muswell Hill

 

[oliver90owner]

The collapsing colonies will already have discharged loads of varroa and disease around the other nearby colonies. I suggest telling them enough is enough and to remove the bees forthwith.

 

[itma]

... a husband and wife team are giving up as they feel they can no longer devote enough time to bee keeping ...

Rather sounds as though that point was reached long ago.

Bit cheeky passing on the bees and saying they want to keep/sell the hives!



I'd suggest that you take the bees into care - in their current boxes - and aim to return the boxes in the Spring. "Too late now for major upset" - and keep a straight face.
If they make it, then get the extra kit. If not, its only the fondant and varroa-treatment wasted.
Alternative is some ugly but cheap Pains poly, while the sale lasts. No assembly or even painting required.

 

[itma]

And treating, why not dust with VarroaGard (asap) put in some strips (if they work, fine, if not shrug) and plan on Oxalic. See where you are in Spring and plan accordingly.


/ Re the current hives - "you won't get much selling them now - much better to sell in Spring!"

 

[Outlander]

Hi Muswell. I recently emailed Vi** asking them what I could use due to the weather turning cooler. They suggested that I still use Apigaurd and leave second lot on and close for winter. Stated that it may not be as affective but would still give a good drop count. So I used Apistan. But I do really agree with the grump teacher this time. Oh and as usual.

Hefting new beeks my ass.

 

[Tom Bick]

If they have a high Varroa load then the damage will perhaps be done now to the winter bees so perhaps no advantage in treating now.

If it was me at this time of year close up the dead hives and perhaps burn the frames ect, feed the other hives, insulate the rooves, treat with oxalic at the usual time if they get that far and then if they make it to the early spring then deal with the bees then.

I would be curious and ask why they want the hives back, are they just looking for you to sort out the mess and then they start again? or are they wanting to sell on?

 

[NickB]

I agree with Tom Bick,but would add that,once winter is over and you see which colonies have survived,the act of transferring them to your own woodwork could be undertaken as a shook swarm,to provide a form of varroa control.

 

[Chris B]

The 2 strong ones are worth helping. Feed and varroa strips and oxalic later. Nothing ventured nothing gained.

 

[Sir Quej]

Make the owners pay for the treatments/feed. Tell them it's that or they can come and take to lot, Bees included.

 

[Skyhook]

Make the owners pay for the treatments/feed. Tell them it's that or they can come and take to lot, Bees included.

Cheeky ****ers!

 

[Poly Hive]

Evening time shut in the abandoned units.

I would at this time leave the untreated ones until Jan and OA treat. If they survive fine and if not problem solved.

However before lifting a hive tool I too would want to know who is paying what for what, as time has a cost as does fuel.

It is after all their responsibility.

PH

 

[rolande]

With Chris B on this.

Further, surely your association has some beginners with no bees yet who would welcome the chance to try and get the colonies through winter with your assistance? Very small financial loss to them if they fail.

I also don't quite understand this idea some other posters have of telling someone that they've got to remove the bees from their own apiary, talk about big brother.

 

[alanf]

They can stay at the apiary and they will give the association the bees but they want to remove and keep all theirs supers and boxes...

Not sure I follow. Who owns (and controls) the apiary? Are they the only beekeepers there? What and when do they intend doing something with the boxes and frames? I appreciate that they may not have communicated their intentions well.

If the apiary is viable for one or more starters to take over, then that's potentially the best outcome, Do you have starters willing to 'give it a go'? This is assuming you're not interested in taking over yourself. First thing I'd want is for all the redundant kit to be sealed and sterilised in whichever order is most convenient and ideally removed asap if it's not available to the new beeks. Next is full agreement of who owns what and who is responsible for it, the last thing you want is putting in the effort over winter only to have the hives and bees reclaimed later because they change their minds. Legally, it actually helps if you give them a quid for whatever you're taking over, a written contract with consideration is a lot harder to reverse.

Then you have a basic triage for each of the four colonies that might be viable. No treatment now because they're basically viable until an oxalic treatment in December, no treatment because they're nearly dead anyway or treat and feed because intervention could produce a viable colony in spring. If they want to take the boxes away asap and you do think the bees are worth saving, you only have a couple of days to get them transferred before the weather turns cold.

 

[MuswellMetro]

With Chris B on this.

Further, surely your association has some beginners with no bees yet who would welcome the chance to try and get the colonies through winter with your assistance? Very small financial loss to them if they fail.

I also don't quite understand this idea some other posters have of telling someone that they've got to remove the bees from their own apiary, talk about big brother.

in normal years ,yes we needs bees for beginners but it has been a swarmy year and we have 15 Nucs in our isolation apairy for beginners next year and a futher 2 nucs in the association apiary, 3 others Donated hives and an abandoded hive already taken over

(I just wonder if the Beekeeping bubble is bursting as our Spring course is not full)

And even I am overwintereing a requeened abanded hive that i was given to me in May when normally i would not want more hives,

So RABs veiws in the first post are gaining ground

i think i will wait and see if the current owners actually put on the bayvarol as they say they will and then go from there depending on the varroa drop.

may be worth a slab of baker fondant and recombine whatever survives to one of two hives in spring....costs well i can catch the bus wth my OAP bus pass...from 184 bus from outside my door and save the petrol in case i need it to cull the bees

 

[richardbees]

MM

"catch the bus with my OAP bus pass... and save the petrol in case i need it to cull the bees"

- Yet another unplanned benefit Ken never thought of!

(possible situations like this albeit on a smaller scale are why I don't like the idea of franchised beehives)

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I fear we may be seeing a bit more of this in the future - it's the fashion at the moment but people not really aware of the responsibility they'e taking on.

'a bee is for life - not just for Christmas'

(it may have six legs but it won't go as far as a turkey!!)

 

[drstitson]

"it may have six legs but it won't go as far as a turkey!"

My Turkeys may fly well and forage freely BUT i doubt even they cover the distances that my bees do (albeit shortened at moment - most doing the 250m round trip from hive to Loquat blossom).

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

"it may have six legs but it won't go as far as a turkey!"

My Turkeys may fly well and forage freely BUT i doubt even they cover the distances that my bees do (albeit shortened at moment - most doing the 250m round trip from hive to Loquat blossom).

Try stuffing a bee with 3 lb of sausagemeat sage and apple stuffing though

 

[beekim]

Poly-Hive is as usual spot on ,some people are just greedy.

 

[rolande]

some people are just greedy.

They've admitted that they are no longer in a position to look after the bees (maybe late in the day, but never the less they've taken some action).

They've offered the bees (and as far as I can tell from the op, the apiary) to their local association; free of charge.

So they want to keep their boxes, which no doubt they've paid for out of hard earned wages. Possibly they want to sell the boxes and recoup some of that investment or they may even (for the time being) hold out hope of starting again in the future.

I fail to see who's being greedy.