Demaree

[Etton]

Having done my first demaree on two hives, if I get QC's in the top box could I select one then introduce a split board instead of the top queen excluder so she will fly from the top entrance. Then replace the queen in the bottom box when she has proved herself or take the top box off as a new hive and start the demaree again by taking all the brood from the bottom box?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Yes - ish
Rather than me trying to tell it all again, have a look in the stickies section where I've shared my notes on Demarree.
Taking the whole top box away and then restarting a new Demarree is one heck of a strain on the queen, colony and honey yield.
I've frequently ended up with two queens in one hive (top and bottom box) allowing me to decide which queen to keep over winter.

 

[Swarm]

Yes - ish
Rather than me trying to tell it all again, have a look in the stickies section where I've shared my notes on Demarree.
Taking the whole top box away and then restarting a new Demarree is one heck of a strain on the queen, colony and honey yield.
I've frequently ended up with two queens in one hive (top and bottom box) allowing me to decide which queen to keep over winter.

Lot's of options with Demarree but removing the entire top box and restarting is not one that I would consider.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Lot's of options with Demarree but removing the entire top box and restarting is not one that I would consider.

Did it once - really prolific queen that I wanted some nucs off, so Demarree'd and had three QC's on separate frames so dismantled the top box and made up three nucs, thinking job done, all good until next year....
Only a few weeks later the hive was full to bursting again, ten frames of brood and the eleventh being looked at so, Demarree'd again with the thought I may just take one more nuc off, luckily I kept those QC's because a check of the bottom box revealed no queen and EQC's being built - queen had totally burnt herself out.

 

[Etton]

If using a split board for the top brood box should its entrance point in a different direction to the bottom entrance?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

If using a split board for the top brood box should its entrance point in a different direction to the bottom entrance?

Same direction - but you are better off using what I call a Demarree board

 

[Erichalfbee]

I've never bothered. I just use a QX with an entrance. Do you think it makes much difference?

 

[jeff33]

I've never bothered. I just use a QX with an entrance. Do you think it makes much difference?

Same here Dani although I have used one on a hive this year for a change and they have made QCs whereas they usually don't with just a QX.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I've never bothered. I just use a QX with an entrance. Do you think it makes much difference?

It does if you want QC's the smaller aperture restricts the amount of pheromone going to the top box - also cheaper cutting up one galv. QX into loads of little squares and buying a sheet of 10mm plywood than having another stack of queen excluders to clean and store.

 

[jeff33]

There is logic there JB ��.
I added another one yesterday to my queenright cell builder and planning to block off the gap for 48h to get them to take the graft. I will re-open afterwards.

 

[Erichalfbee]

It does if you want QC's the smaller aperture restricts the amount of pheromone going to the top box - also cheaper cutting up one galv. QX into loads of little squares and buying a sheet of 10mm plywood than having another stack of queen excluders to clean and store.

Of course.

 

[TryingToLetThemBee]

There is logic there JB ��.
I added another one yesterday to my queenright cell builder and planning to block off the gap for 48h to get them to take the graft. I will re-open afterwards.

Team how risky are Q+ Demaree QC-builders?

I have to decide whether to let a Q- AS (from a Demaree that did not prevent swarm prep) reQ naturally and I want to build cells upstairs. But having lost and caught a cast swarm in similar circumstances (things are CRAZY strong here) I am a bit wary.

Thoughts?

 

[jeff33]

Team how risky are Q+ Demaree QC-builders?

I have to decide whether to let a Q- AS (from a Demaree that did not prevent swarm prep) reQ naturally and I want to build cells upstairs. But having lost and caught a cast swarm in similar circumstances (things are CRAZY strong here) I am a bit wary.

Thoughts?

It's not a question of risky, it's a question of ensuring that which ever method you use you have sufficient nurse bees to develop viable and good quality Qcs. how old is your Q- AS, is it still full of brood about to emerge?

 

[TryingToLetThemBee]

It's not a question of risky, it's a question of ensuring that which ever method you use you have sufficient nurse bees to develop viable and good quality Qcs. how old is your Q- AS, is it still full of brood about to emerge?

4 days: plenty of time. But it has sealed cells now and if I let a Q emerge and mate while fooling around with QCs up top, is there a risk they swarm or - real nightmare - swarm a virgin?

 

[jeff33]

IMO if your Q- AS was made up of all the brood and non flying bees it is unlikely to swarm as the swarming fever will be with the flying bees which should be the other part of the split with the queen and no brood?

 

[Etton]

Same direction - but you are better off using what I call a Demarree board

View attachment 18103

View attachment 18104

Great advice, and the sticky thread really useful too.
Made my 'demaree boards' today, hopefully they will help with having an exit/entrance from the top BB.
Did my two demarees on the 15th & 16th May, not inspected either hive since, but plan to 7 days from the date of the demaree. Intending to add my demaree boards tomorrow, then do my inspections on the 22nd & 23rd-weather allowing.
Does this sound an ok plan?

 

[TryingToLetThemBee]

IMO if your Q- AS was made up of all the brood and non flying bees it is unlikely to swarm as the swarming fever will be with the flying bees which should be the other part of the split with the queen and no brood?

Yes: fingers crossed! Thanks all

 

[citrus]

unwinding a demarree

how quickly do people do that .. I know JBM talked about running a rolling demarree for a few weeks ( i think I tried it last year for about a month)

but could after a fortnight could you put the hive back into its normal configuration ?

 

[jeff33]

I don't see the point, you may as well run it on dble brood if you are going to reconfigure. The idea is to provide space for the queen to lay and avoid congestion that may trigger swarming. The rolling approach provides the empty frames for the queen to lay but for me anyway the frames get filled with nectar as the brood emerges so I can't re-use them until I have put them in the extractor.

 

[citrus]

yeah sorry I should have been clear ... i normally run double brood so would just be putting the top bb back as the top of a double brood box and stick the supers that were doing the seperating back in their normal position above.