bubble wrap as insulation

[sprocker]

Just wondering what people thought of using bubble wrap as an insulation in an eke on hives thanks aidy

 

[Erichalfbee]

No where near as good as recticel/kingspan.
Derek will have the figures and I'm sure he will be along shortly.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Derek will have the figures and I'm sure he will be along shortly.

Nah - he's off picketing a distillery somewhere

 

[sprocker]

Thanks it just that iv got a bit lying around and thought I'd see what others opinions were thanks aidy

 

[masterBK]

I have used Miller feeders with the two compartments filled with folded bubble wrap as top insulation in the past. Not as good as Celotex but does a reasonable job. Bees are unable to get at it to chew it.

 

[REDWOOD]

I've used it before, not as good as kingspan but good in an emergency, shove a bit under your jumper and you will soon see how good it is (old motorbike days)

 

[drstitson]

how much are your bees worth?
how much does under half a 1.2m x 0.5m sheet of 50mm kingspan cost?
bin the bubble wrap and get down to wickes or local builder's skip.

 

[oliver90owner]

Air transfers thermal energy easily by convection, while it is actually a very good insulator (ie poor conductor); hence lots and lots of very tiny air 'bubbles'/'cells' of whatever, each isolated from every other to prevent gaseous movement is best. Bubble wrap has few layers of large air bubbles, so is much poorer in the insulation department. Plastics are not necessarily that good as insulators; that is why low density 'packaging' expanded polystyrene is a better insulator than the denser beehive material. Building polystyrene insulation is denser than packaging type for extra compressive strength. Think of the thin single layer polystyrene cups - they are useless as insulators!

So, in a nutshell, smaller air cells rule OK where insulation properties are concerned.

 

[sprocker]

Thanks a lot for your advice everyone kingspan it is cheers aidy

 

[Tom Bick]

You can buy a very expensive insulation at most builder suppliers these days it looks like bubble wrap covered in tinfoil apparently it claims to be extremely good and some people rate it but I have my reservations.

 

[Swarm]

Is that thinsulate type insulation sheets, Tom?

 

[user 6228]

You can buy a very expensive insulation at most builder suppliers these days it looks like bubble wrap covered in tinfoil apparently it claims to be extremely good and some people rate it but I have my reservations.

about the same performance as 4mm of polystyrene... i.e. which is the the same performance of 2.7mm of PIR or 15mm of wood

 

[Tom Bick]

Is that thinsulate type insulation sheets, Tom?

No swarm it's literally bubble wrap covered in a tinfoil type covering.

 

[Jimy Dee]

I took a slightly different approach to using bubble wrap.
Instead of putting it into a super/eke and using it solely as an insulated "attic", I wrapped my entire hive with bubble wrap so the bubble wrap acted as a second "skin" outside the hive. The bubble wrap went around the 4 sides and over the top of the hive.

I did this on the basis that the hive exterior would be dryer (not directly exposed to rain etc), it would act as a wind break and finally the bubble wrap had to be of some insulation value. It should be noted that it is accepted in passive house theory that air tightness allows a person get the best from their insulation. Air circulation greatly reduces the effectiveness of insulation.

Back to my experiment - I did the bubble wrap this autumn and next spring will tell the tale. I have failed to upload the photo but i will work on it - at least when you see the funny hive you can have a giggle (or should that be a bubble!)

 

[djg]

Hi Jimy Dee,

I have used bubble-wrap on my London rooftop hives. The hives are very exposed and I generally wrap them from early December to late January, depending on weather conditions. The hives all have OMF and mosueguards on. I simply cut a 74" length of bubble wrap, deploy a few drawing pins to fix it tight around the hives and tuck the a couple of spare inches of bubble-wrap under the Kingspanned roof and a wooden crownboard (with the feed-holes covered with strips of lino).

The bees have survived every winter and then build up nicely - and for the last 2 years, I have monitored temperature and humidity with a cheap Chinese imported device on top of the cluster.

Like you, I am more interested in reducing extreme wind-chill on wet hive walls than on the prospects for insulation.

And I'm not going to post a photo of a bubble-wrapped hive, because it looks so naff.....

 

[MartinL]

Is that thinsulate type insulation sheets, Tom?

All the thin sheet insulations make claims that are only ever substantiated when they are sealed with tape to form a perfectly airtight enclosure. Usually high spec new-builds, rarely anything else!
Wouldn't touch them with a barge pole.

 

[user 6228]

Hi Jimy Dee,

I have used bubble-wrap on my London rooftop hives. The hives are very exposed and I generally wrap them from early December to late January, depending on weather conditions. The hives all have OMF and mosueguards on. I simply cut a 74" length of bubble wrap, deploy a few drawing pins to fix it tight around the hives and tuck the a couple of spare inches of bubble-wrap under the Kingspanned roof and a wooden crownboard (with the feed-holes covered with strips of lino).

The bees have survived every winter and then build up nicely - and for the last 2 years, I have monitored temperature and humidity with a cheap Chinese imported device on top of the cluster.

Like you, I am more interested in reducing extreme wind-chill on wet hive walls than on the prospects for insulation.

And I'm not going to post a photo of a bubble-wrapped hive, because it looks so naff.....

2mm black correx sheet £6 for 2.4m x 1.2m from. jewsons will serve the same purpose but less naff

 

[itma]

You can buy a very expensive insulation at most builder suppliers these days it looks like bubble wrap covered in tinfoil apparently it claims to be extremely good and some people rate it but I have my reservations.

"Multifoil" insulation (eg Tri-Iso) is not recommended/approved for insulating horizontal surfaces - like a coverboard.
Similarly, multi layers of bubblewrap or radiator-back insulation aren't good for horizontal application. *

Radiator-back insulation isn't specially wonderful, but it is thin - which is what is needed for putting behind a radiator.

Kingspan/Celotex/Recticell/Xtratherm/etc foil-faced insulation foam board is well-suited to beehive application, and, per hive, cheap - compared to the value of the bees or the cost of the rest of the hive.



* Horizontal orientation doesn't work because somewhere in the multi-layer sandwich, the Dew Point will be reached, and then the insulation won't.

 

[itma]

Hi Jimy Dee,

I have used bubble-wrap on my London rooftop hives. The hives are very exposed and I generally wrap them from early December to late January, depending on weather conditions. The hives all have OMF and mosueguards on. I simply cut a 74" length of bubble wrap, deploy a few drawing pins to fix it tight around the hives and tuck the a couple of spare inches of bubble-wrap under the Kingspanned roof and a wooden crownboard (with the feed-holes covered with strips of lino).

… I am more interested in reducing extreme wind-chill on wet hive walls than on the prospects for insulation.

And I'm not going to post a photo of a bubble-wrapped hive, because it looks so naff.....

The proper answer to this is a poly, rather than wood, hive …

Plastic-wrapped wooden hives are going to be subject to accelerated rotting of the wood, compared to non-wrapped wooden hives, regardless of any effect of wind-chill.
I have suggested loose sheets of Tyvek (breathable) roofing membrane as a 'drape' protection against woodpecker damage. It might be better for your application as well. And re-usable in subsequent years.

 

[djg]

Hi itma,

I am trialling a poly hive in my Suffolk apiary this winter. Amazingly, I'm the first in the local BKA to use a poly...

The disadvantages of using a poly so far are small: my frame-rest won't hook over the poly hive walls and the roof has been puffed along by the wind during an inspection. Neither are at all serious in rural Suffolk, but both problems on a 4th floor rooftop accessed along narrow gullies an overlooking a busy London street!