brilliant or dumb idea to solve Q- swarm?

[Ape Resi]

I am not sure if it was a great idea or a really dumb one, but here it goes.

after taking home a swarm some weeks ago and no sign of queen to be found, I checked again today and still no queen. workers bring in some nectar but nothing capped. The colony will be about 200-250 bees max. also majority of the workers hover and stick their bum in the air as well as about half congregate on the hive floor.

few people mentioned to me the noise a queen less hive does - but heard nothing special just just a 'stressed' hum...

Today as i checked my other hive which is going incredibly well, I moved a frame with newly laid eggs (vertical) into the middle of the 'swarm' hive. seemed a good idea at the time - I am not 100% sure now...

hope they will get their act together and make one of the new eggs into a 'emergency' queen - wishful thinking?

what do you think?

ttfn, r

 

[Poly Hive]

At 250 bees you barely have a mini nuc. Giving them a whole frame of brood may lose most of the brood.

PH

 

[oliver90owner]

As PH. 250 bees is not a viable colony. Attending one queen in a mating hive uses probably more bees than that. Not even enough to have a laying worker, I would think.

Forget these 200 bees and develop a nuc from your incedible hive as soon as the present flow ceases. In preparation, if you can, split some brood/eggs to the top(?) of the hive for them to draw supercedure cells and use a good one to add to your nucleus hive.

Regards, RAB

 

[Ape Resi]

Thanks PH and RAB for your help...which raises some questions RAB!

in advance - this is my second summer - having received my first colony nuc last June, so not even a full year in!

Forget these 200 bees and develop a nuc from your incedible hive as soon as the present flow ceases.

the weather here has broken - does this means the flow of nectar will cease? saying this I have a brill field of kale in full flower just a field away... how would i know for sure the flow has ceased?

and once i know how to i create a new nuc?

In preparation, if you can, split some brood/eggs to the top(?) of the hive for them to draw supercedure cells and use a good one to add to your nucleus hive.

i.e. place a brood box on top on my top super (the 'good' hive has already got 2 supers above QE)

how does a 'good' queen cell looks like

oooh - looks/sounds a bit complicated but very interesting too! thanks for the help and for patience to the many questions!

one last one (for now...) everyone says to read Hooper - just thought to check I have the right book: Guide to Bees and Honey, 4th edition? any other 'practical beekeeping' reading that will help me in this situation?

cheers!

ttfn, R

 

[Midland Beek]

What swarm doesn't have a queen? If it was a queenless swarm I doubt it would have stayed put. I do not ever bother looking for a virgin queen because it is pointless from the point of view that you generally cannot find them.

Have you stuck a queen excluder under the swarm? If so, can any unmated queen fly and mate?

 

[oliver90owner]

Ape Resi,

Your colony is doing OK. I wouldn't term it incredible, but the term is subjective. Double brood and on the 4th super, or maybe the 5th would be more like I would expect for that description.

My bees are on 14 x 12 and often into a super with brood at this time of the year. So I can temporarily use shallow frames with eggs in the top box. It depends on what you have - I did say, 'if you can'.

how would i know for sure the flow has ceased?

You will know. Honey production will fall, bees will be more defensive, more foragers at home, preparations for swarming, the forage may be obviously 'going over'. Lots of signs.

how does a 'good' queen cell looks like

It will be big and have a larva developing in it.Like a large acorn on the side of the comb.

You can stick to the basics and await swarm cells if you wish, but I find it is more under my control if they are producing supercedure type cells rather than swarm cells and I know that I can remove them without the bees making queen cells from older larvae and departing early.

There are lots of good bee books but I usually get out my trusty Wedmore (1940s era) as a reference for most things. Little has changed in the bee behaviour part, but one has to be aware that varroa was unknown, some of the medications used then are definitely a 'no-no' these days - and no DNA those days either! So not for a newbie, perhaps.

Regards, RAB