2 Queen hive?

[wwwcight]

Um, I'm sure I've heard something about people running hives with 2 brood boxes, 1 at the top and one at the bottom with supers in between, the queens separated by queen excluders with a top and bottom entrance.

Why do I ask? Well on my swarm hive, I left out the excluder for a week to encourage the bees up into the super. I put an excluder in after getting a load of brood in the bottom of that. Now a couple of weeks later I have a queen cell in the top super. Now I have used a national brood as my super (its what I bought as a second hand hive), so there isn't a size concern (my brood chamber is commercial).
As the queen cell was so far up I figured it to be a succession cell rather than a swarm cell, but there is nothing wrong with the current queen as far as I can see.


Choices,

I could kill that queen cell
I could kill the original queen and wait for the new queen to hatch
I could wait for the new queen to hatch, then kill the old queen
I could sell the new queen, the old queen is a hell of a layer so good genes.
I could split the hive, but expect that would sacrifice getting a honey crop this year
I could try for a 2 queen hive as above and split later.

thoughts?

n

 

[CB008]

Sounds like a Snelgrove Board to me

 

[wwwcight]

You're talking about a 2 queen hive option, right? Sorry I'm a bit new, so I'm not quite sure I'm following.

Well isn't a Snelgrove Board about keeping the bees apart but sharing warmth? I was thinking of keeping the queens apart but giving the other bees free roaming. Or would the bees get one scent or the other and then start fighting?

 

[chickendave]

Not enough information to pass comment on really

1st how many frames of eggs, larvae and capped brood do you have, because that will detemine what actions if any you take with regard to splitting the hive at this time of year.when you were letting the queen have full access to both brood boxes you were running a double brood. our both brood boxes bursting with bees?

2nd is the QS capped or open where on the frame is the cell? middle, bottom, side, if it's not a supersedure cell they may well swarm. Is your current queen marked/clipped is she still there? is she still laying?

 

[drstitson]

2qs

here are details of the 2 queen system.

i was actually only wondering the other day whether a late produced 2QS could be used to boost winter bee numbers rather than foragers - say removing one queen at start of september.

anyone tried it?

 

[Crg]

here are details of the 2 queen system.

i was actually only wondering the other day whether a late produced 2QS could be used to boost winter bee numbers rather than foragers - say removing one queen at start of september.

anyone tried it?

I've run two queen hives previously in NZ, a beekeeper near me is running one at the moment.

Using a two queen system to boost winter bee numbers seems to be the reverse of what the system is generally trying to achieve.

 

[drstitson]

"Using a two queen system to boost winter bee numbers seems to be the reverse of what the system is generally trying to achieve."

i realise that BUT if one were the unfortunate owner of Carnies that needed A/S ing again at this time of year perhaps doing a taranov and running 2 queens til early autumn might be something to try?

 

[wwwcight]

Not enough information to pass comment on really

1st how many frames of eggs, larvae and capped brood do you have, because that will detemine what actions if any you take with regard to splitting the hive at this time of year.

quite a lot, probably 8 out of 11 frames in the commercial brood have a really strong brood pattern both sides. In the national brood box (one I was using as a super) she put brood in about 20% on the bottom of about 6 frames, both sided

when you were letting the queen have full access to both brood boxes you were running a double brood. our both brood boxes bursting with bees?

I was using the commercial brood, as brood, and the national brood as a super. I had left the queen excluder out to encourage them to pull out the top frames and put honey in them. I also gave them sugar syrup cos they were starving. At that point the bees were bursting out of the commercial box.
Now with the super on, the commercial is still bursting and the super is very well covered.

2nd is the QS capped or open where on the frame is the cell? middle, bottom, side, if it's not a supersedure cell they may well swarm. Is your current queen marked/clipped is she still there? is she still laying?

capped, middle, marked, clipped, still laying for england.

 

[wwwcight]

Using a two queen system to boost winter bee numbers seems to be the reverse of what the system is generally trying to achieve.

I wasn't so much trying to boost numbers for winter, just trying to get the best honey crop possible before the end of summer, as I don't have anything I can extract yet. I also didn't want to throw away a perfectly good new queen, or split and get rid of the bit of a honey crop I might get.

Unless you think a split is just the best option...? Missing a crop this year would be disappointing, but I'm prepared to do that if it is the best option for the bees.

 

[Howsoonisnow]

Does anyone use the two queen system to take the bees through winter?

Or has anyone tried it?

So the hive would consist of 2 brood boxes divided by a Qx. Or maybe divided by a Qx and a crown board with feed holes open?

 

[drstitson]

"Does anyone use the two queen system to take the bees through winter?

Or has anyone tried it?

So the hive would consist of 2 brood boxes divided by a Qx. Or maybe divided by a Qx and a crown board with feed holes open?"

I was thinking of using the 2 boxes and two queens up until say mid-end of september and then removing older queen, leaving new queen in bottom box.
that way you get a big hit of newly emerged bees that don't have to waste energy feeding brood and will be ready to go into winter.