When to go to double brood

[Stedic]

Maybe a daft question.

I’ve always had my bees on 14x12s. My mentor always uses brood and a half, regardless of colony size. Having just switched to standard nationals I am expecting to need to move a couple of hives to double brood.

But...

How do you decide a colony needs to go to double brood, rather than needing an extra super? Do you wait until there are 8 or 9 frames of brood? Are there better or worse times in the season to add the second brood box?

 

[Poly Hive]

Personally, I super on 8 frames of brood and add the 2nd brood box. If they want it they expand down and of course with the upper BB full of brood they store in the super as I want them to. Nice and simple. I should add I am giving foundation in the supers every time as I work for cut comb only.

PH

 

[Millet]

I put a colony on double brood today as the Queen had limmited space to lay..she has laid eight frames of bias and filled a ninth frame full of eggs so that was my trigger..I stuck the new brood box underneath so it will hurt nothing if they decide not to use it but the space is there if it is needed.

 

[Stedic]

Ah, so the box going below allows them to move the brood nest down, but their natural urge is to place stores above the nest.

Makes a lot of sense. Presumably if they don’t use the lower box you can switch it to the top to give them a place for autumn stores.

 

[Levitt53]

I've got one colony nicely contained in one brood box but with 3 supers. Also two colonies wall to wall with brood so now with two brood boxes but just the 2 supers. It just depends. You have to just decide based on what is in front of you.

 

[Millet]

Ah, so the box going below allows them to move the brood nest down, but their natural urge is to place stores above the nest.

Makes a lot of sense. Presumably if they don’t use the lower box you can switch it to the top to give them a place for autumn stores.

The colony in question also has three supers above the Queen excluder..

 

[Curly green fingers]

Maybe a daft question.

I’ve always had my bees on 14x12s. My mentor always uses brood and a half, regardless of colony size. Having just switched to standard nationals I am expecting to need to move a couple of hives to double brood.

But...

How do you decide a colony needs to go to double brood, rather than needing an extra super? Do you wait until there are 8 or 9 frames of brood? Are there better or worse times in the season to add the second brood box?

Best times to add a second brood box when you have a honey flow .
Worst times when you have a dearth .
I've got one colony which is now three brood boxes and has drawn 9 + frames in 4 days this colony are right next to lots of osr and cider orchards .
The prolificness of your queen/s and the forage available should be how you make that assumption.

 

[Murox]

Its a balance of giving enough space for expansion and nectar at the right time. As Curly green fingers said the prolificity of the queen and abundance of forage matter. Poly Hives method is as he says nice and simple; you just need to know flow timing for the area.

 

[eltalia]

No doubt someone before today has posted the math for broodnest management within
the broodchamber, I'll leave off those damning facts for the error of "more is better".
Attached is set goal over what many owning little to none concern for bee task efficiency
advocate for - double brood boxes.
Two classic errors in that mantra are;
greater volume = greater engine room energy losses
greater numbers = greater stores 'waste'

Manage the bees denying that impetus to create a rid for your own back, literally.

Bill

 

[Poly Hive]

Murox? Nothing to do with flow timing, thats a complication. You tell me when a flow will happen in Scotland? That's like herding cats TBH. Today I am off to super a colony in an out apiary at 11c. There is no flow but the bees will go up and start on the foundation because they are in poly.

I repeat I do it by the strength of the colony and that is the only factor. I know that at 8 frames of brood they both need supering and the 2nd BB. I know this from experience of this strain of bee.

PH

 

[Murox]

Murox? Nothing to do with flow timing, thats a complication. You tell me when a flow will happen in Scotland? That's like herding cats TBH. Today I am off to super a colony in an out apiary at 11c. There is no flow but the bees will go up and start on the foundation because they are in poly.

I repeat I do it by the strength of the colony and that is the only factor. I know that at 8 frames of brood they both need supering and the 2nd BB. I know this from experience of this strain of bee.

PH

Yes flow time is a complication and colony strength is crucial.

 

[Curly green fingers]

Murox? Nothing to do with flow timing, thats a complication. You tell me when a flow will happen in Scotland? That's like herding cats TBH. Today I am off to super a colony in an out apiary at 11c. There is no flow but the bees will go up and start on the foundation because they are in poly.

I repeat I do it by the strength of the colony and that is the only factor. I know that at 8 frames of brood they both need supering and the 2nd BB. I know this from experience of this strain of bee.

PH

I get what your saying pH , in may hives are building up a lot , if there's no flow then they are going to be utilizing there stores and if they don't have much then why will they build up unless they've had a lot of supplements ie... Spring syrup or lots of winter stores left over fondant/ ivy/Hb.