Really at a loss now

[ShinySideUp]

In another thread I said that in a colony I had left two queen cells and now they have swarmed but I've just gone over my notes.

The colony in question had no queen. The SBI couldn't find her, I couldn't find her, there were no eggs, no larvae and very few sealed cells -- the colony was potentially doomed. A test frame was put in and the bees produced many QC's and it is those that I reduced to two. Now here is the rub, the test frame was put in on the 24th June, just 11 days before the hive swarmed today and that is not enough time for a queen to develop.

What has gone wrong? I'm a bit lost now, no, I am very lost now.

My only thought is that there was a queen there all the time but she was just not laying and the test frame was used by the workers to produce swarm cells -- can this be it? Oh, and why do my bees hate me?!!!

 

[Beecat]

Oh, and why do my bees hate me?!!!

Well we'll have to take this one step at a time.

1. Are they always angry?
2. Do they sting everybody, not just you?
3. Are they very old?


If yes to all of the above, then the answer is clear and definitive. You have Finnish bees.

 

[colinc]

Isn’t it 16 days from egg to Queen? And they may have started a 3 day old larva or older in an emergency.
My brain is fuddled this morning but they may have used an older larva than is ideal.

Hope they settle soon

 

[Anduril]

11 days test frame.
3 days egg
2 days larva
11+3+2=16 days for test frame.
2 day old larva used to raise queen.

 

[ShinySideUp]

There were eggs on the test frame so I would have thought is unlikely they would use larvae.

BTW when I said my bees hate me, I don't mean they were attacking me, I meant they were fickle as if they were doing things to frustrate me at every turn "'cos it's just fun to keep him guessing". I suppose I should be pleased because if I can get everyone through this alive and in fine fettle then if I ever get reliable bees I will have a restful time indeed.

 

[enrico]

There were eggs on the test frame so I would have thought is unlikely they would use larvae.

BTW when I said my bees hate me, I don't mean they were attacking me, I meant they were fickle as if they were doing things to frustrate me at every turn "'cos it's just fun to keep him guessing". I suppose I should be pleased because if I can get everyone through this alive and in fine fettle then if I ever get reliable bees I will have a restful time indeed.

Ha ha! Mine still test me! If you get a restful time then you are probably doing something wrong!!!!!

 

[colinc]

if they are in a rush for emergency queens they will use larva

 

[Poly Hive]

Bees normally use larvae to aise queens NOT eggs so that blows that one up.

When they are in a hurry they can and will use up to three day old larvae so I think that may be your answer.

PH

 

[Beecat]

if I ever get reliable bees I will have a restful time indeed.

Having followed your recent threads, I am starting to understand why people will pay so much for a really first rate queen.

Now if they could just select for bees that extract, bottle and sell honey....

 

[ShinySideUp]

Bees normally use larvae to aise queens NOT eggs so that blows that one up.

When they are in a hurry they can and will use up to three day old larvae so I think that may be your answer.

PH

Thank you for that (and all the folks other replies too).

Oh well, I managed to catch the swarm and it's in another nuc now (not for long, it was a hell of a swarm) and I still have the old one so I have yet another colony -- it's all getting a bit silly now, I may have to up my Bee Disease Insurance.

 

[colinc]

I went from a nuc in late April to 3 full colonies in late June in my first year. I managed 12lb of honey too but they ended the year all on double brood.

They swarmed into the kitchen roof and had to be broken out before they settled in there, although with hindsight I suspect they would have moved on, then a few weeks later into the hedge.
I caught both swarms and my swarm control (touch wood and everything crossed) has prevented me throwing a swarm since.
As long as we learn from our mistakes then its all part of the fun, or not.

good luck with them.

 

[mickbees23]

My only thought is that there was a queen there all the time but she was just not laying and the test frame was used by the workers to produce swarm cells -- can this be it? Oh, and why do my bees hate me?!!!

Giving the timings you state it sounds to me exactly what has happened.
Did your SBI not point out if there were polished cells in the centre frames or not ? It's lucky to spot a new queen dashing about but good patches of cleaned cells in the middle of the frames are a very good indication there is a queen in there some place coming into lay.