Moving clustered bees

[Summerslease]

Hi again. After starting a controversy with a query about a 2 queen system, and getting some excellent advice and opinions I'd like to have another go.

I need to move a hive in my garden apiary about 20 feet to start the new season. It's in an inconvenient position because of various short moves through this year. I have left it until now as I understand hives can be moved more than 3 feet in one move in the winter when the bees are clustered as the bees lose their memory of the hive position when they haven't flown for a while.

What I would like to know is how long should the bees be clustered and not flying before I move them the whole 20feet?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Wait for a prolonged cold snap - where it's unlikely the bees will fly for a good few days then carefully move them - lean a board across the entrance or some twiggy branches so that when they do start flying it will force them to re orientate. I've got two to move and i'm waiting for the really wintery weather

 

[Sir Quej]

I also have some to move but the dirt road i need to go down is a little rough so "Carefully" probably wont apply.

Any Advice?

 

[Pete D]

I moved 8 hives 50 yds last winter with the help of Mrs D. There was snow on the ground and I closed the entrances, strapped them and between us carried them, stopping along the way several times for Mrs D to catch her breath and then placed them in their new positions.
We tried to be as gentle as possible but there was the enevitable bump.
I left the entrances closed untill the next day (mesh floors) and opened them early morning and placed an obstacle over the entrance area, branch, tray, board, whatever was to hand. No bees came out when opened.
All ok with none returning to the original location (left a nuc there) that I knew of, certainly not any laying dead in the snow at old location.
Sure the snow helped but would do the same again in the cold weather forecasted this weekend if I needed too.
good luck
Pete D

 

[Ely]

I moved 8 hives 50 yds last winter with the help of Mrs D. There was snow on the ground and I closed the entrances, strapped them and between us carried them, stopping along the way several times for Mrs D to catch her breath and then placed them in their new positions.
We tried to be as gentle as possible but there was the enevitable bump.
I left the entrances closed untill the next day (mesh floors) and opened them early morning and placed an obstacle over the entrance area, branch, tray, board, whatever was to hand. No bees came out when opened.
All ok with none returning to the original location (left a nuc there) that I knew of, certainly not any laying dead in the snow at old location.
Sure the snow helped but would do the same again in the cold weather forecasted this weekend if I needed too.
good luck
Pete D

It seems like the old 3 foot, 3mile mile rule of thumb is pretty out dated

 

[oliver90owner]

It seems like the old 3 foot, 3mile mile rule of thumb is pretty out dated

Not at all. It is very appropriate for those that just move hives without rubbing brain cells together.

 

[Black Comb]

It seems like the old 3 foot, 3mile mile rule of thumb is pretty out dated

It is in a winter cold snap as described.
But at all other times of year it still applies.

 

[margob99]

It seems like the old 3 foot, 3mile mile rule of thumb is pretty out dated

Not at all. It is very appropriate for those that just move hives without rubbing brain cells together.

Post of the Year!


M

 

[Pete D]

It is in a winter cold snap as described.
But at all other times of year it still applies.

Yes it was in a winter cold snap. Other times I would apply it.

Having said that if I really had to move them I would do all I can to try and aleviate the issues and move them.

Used it to my advantage with a bad tempered hive that didnt want me too inspect them to see what their issue was. I moved it 200 yds and bled the aggressive flyers off (they went back to the apiary and either hung about or pushed in another hive), did the inspection, found them queenless and broodless, gave them a frame with eggs and moved them back.

Pete D

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Not at all. It is very appropriate for those that just move hives without rubbing brain cells together.

Humph - some of us don't have the luxury of a spare cell to rub against the other

 

[Ely]

I meant...there seems to be a few techniques of moving hives that I am learning about on these forums. Books will usually inform you of 3 mile rule and nothing else. No criticism intended.

 

[Pete D]

I think a lot of the 'rules' are more of a guide and that most can be adapted to suit a particular situation and although the result may not be the best it could of been it will still 'work'.
The bees do seem to be very resilient despite our worst efforts !

Pete D

 

[Sir Quej]

I meant...there seems to be a few techniques of moving hives that I am learning about on these forums. Books will usually inform you of 3 mile rule and nothing else. No criticism intended.

Nothing better than experience.....

 

[Summerslease]

Thanks for everyone's collective rubbing of brain cells, it's helpful to have so much experience at the press of a few keys. I will wait for a good cold spell, when they will be indoors for a few days.

 

[oliver90owner]

I will wait for a good cold spell, when they will be indoors for a few days.

That is rubbing brain cells. When they have been in (rather than 'will be') for a good few days (who can trust our forecasters?) would be even better.

I could move a beehive less than three feet and lose all the foragers. I know how I could achieve that, but clearly not too clever in practice, so best avoided! Weather, topography, foraging range can all affect movement of beehives. Generally (excluding my extreme example above), the rule works.

 

[Ely]

I have read of (not practised myself so I'm not sure of the cons, which is why I'm asking this question) beekeepers actually shutting the bees in themselves rather than wait for a cold spell. I have read about examples of this during the summer. They closed the bees in, relocated, put a branch over the entrance and free'd the entrance after around 24 hours or so. They had no returning foragers to previous spot around 20ft away. Is there something wrong with that practise? People shut their bees in to travel 100s of miles so it can't be shutting them in that is the problem.

 

[iombeeman]

in my own view moving bees in winter is not about problems over orientation
but causing stress to wintering bees.every time you move a hive the bees are aware they are on the move,they gear up to defend themselves,consume stores
and increasing general stress in the hive.wait until spring. i feel this is the best course

 

[Ely]

I assume they only want to move them once, not repeatedly. It ain't really going to make much difference to anything in the grand scheme of things really

 

[Summerslease]

Thanks for that RAB. I will wait until they have been in for a few days and also when the forecast shows they are likely to remain in for a few days after the move.
I also take the point about a winter move stressing them and making them consume more stores. Fortunately they are all well fed with fondant and the moves are only 10's of feet. I thought I'd try a winter move before being more adventurous with a warm weather shutting them in type move with a leafy branch as a distraction when they emerge. (There's one on YouTube which was successful).