Is it worth my while starting beekeeping?

[trevorandfiona]

Thanks for all the replies - there is certainly a lot to mull over there! I suspect it might be a bit of a non-starter at home though. My garden is actually quite big, but it is long and narrow - about 90ft x 16ft. Neighbours on one side won't mind at all but the other side are a nightmare (in all aspects - haven't even mentioned bees yet). They have a seating area in the centre of their garden so the hive would have to be right up at the end. My only saving grace is that there is a railway line across the rear of the garden so it isn't going to both anyone on that boundary. Lots of squashed bees though probably...

 

[trevorandfiona]

Incidentally, there is a good view of my garden in Google Maps - search for my address - 58 Greenock Road, Bishopton - my house is the one with the blue van parked out the front.

 

[Headnavigator]

I'm a little baffled by the 'nay-sayers' on this issue of bees in a garden. Have bees changed over time? when I was a kid I spent much of my time with my Grandparents and was out in their garden every fine moment of each Summer. During my childhood I had a couple of wasp stings when I was on the beach (candy-floss induced probably!) but not one sting while I was in the garden. No bee stings. I have photos still of me from babyhood onward in this garden. No more than ten foot away from the lawn outside the (ever-open) kitchen and living-room windows were about thirty colonies. I can remember the constant hum of the bees and being told very clearly that I was NOT to walk among the hives or in front of them. That's all. Are we being a bit OTT over the risks now, or have bees changed so much? Or were my cousins and I peculiarly lucky?

 

[MandF]

Wasps rarely sting out of sheer malice. If you have been through a beehive on a bad day then bees will make sure that they sting something...What I am trying to say is that it may not happen for a few years but when it does you may end a good relationship with neighbours! I believe we all have a responsibility as keepers of bees and if there is ANY choice then my answer would be don't do it in a small garden. Sorry! Nothing wrong with a big garden where you can surrounds them with bushes and trees but .... Terrace garden? Not for me
E

Who said it was a "small" garden?! My last house was a detached house and I had a 30' garden or thereabouts.

I now live in a semi-detached, ex local authority, and my garden is 90' long.

Also alongside there are local authority maisonettes, the bottom one has the closest garden to the block, the upper one has the furthest one, so despite "only" being say 40' square, it starts 50' from the block.

Every garden, every situation is different, and the decision should be based on their personal circumstances.

I will repeat what I said on another thread on this subject, my local association is in a residential area, the hives (around a dozen) are kept in probably about 40' square area, with residential gardens on 2 sides, and a youth community centre garden the other.

It was founded in 1919, and is still there now, despite having amateur beeks molesting them every friday evening during the season.

Sort of flies in the face (no pun intended) of your doom and gloom scenario no?

 

[MandF]

Thanks for all the replies - there is certainly a lot to mull over there! I suspect it might be a bit of a non-starter at home though. My garden is actually quite big, but it is long and narrow - about 90ft x 16ft. Neighbours on one side won't mind at all but the other side are a nightmare (in all aspects - haven't even mentioned bees yet). They have a seating area in the centre of their garden so the hive would have to be right up at the end. My only saving grace is that there is a railway line across the rear of the garden so it isn't going to both anyone on that boundary. Lots of squashed bees though probably...

Thats almost identical to my garden layout - the end of the garden is perfect for them, and bees fly up and out, so dont worry about them getting squished by trains! You will see the secret is to put fences up (if not already there) to force them up above head height, even with a busy hive in the height of summer, I doubt your horrible neighbours would even know you had a hive, apart from seeing you in your suit!

a 90' garden is definitely doable.

 

[enrico]

Please don't think I am being negative. Give it a try but have somewhere you may be able to take them if it should fail. Good luck and keep us informed!
E

 

[MandF]

Wasps rarely sting out of sheer malice.

I forgot to add - the difference with wasps, as you well know, is that they will and DO bother humans in the garden. If I am sitting out on the decking during the summer, with a glass of wine & some food, I get bothered by wasps, and not a single bee, despite having 100,000 of them 60' or so away.

So wasps do bother people, and when they swipe them away they can get stung.

 

[enrico]

That's cos you swiped them away. A bee will sting without waiting for the swipe!

 

[Swarm]

....'Generally.'
Can't say wasps do, bees don't. There are times when both apply equally.
Generally it's wasps who are in your face and around your food or drink. If you've done an inspection earlier, it could be a bee that persistently buzzes your face (very intimidating for a half inch insect, heh) Swipe at a wasp and most of the time you'll get away with it, I've not seen this with a bee. You better do a good job because anything less means you will be stung.
Likewise, have a Q- hive or one where the new queen has yet to start laying and things can become a bit interesting. I've been buzzed at 20 yards and I've been stung (zero warning) at 40 yards, right outside the back door.
That said, these are the only two occasions and the bees settled down once HM was doing her thing.
My garden is around 40 yards and backs onto a wooded stream. Up a fairly steep bank some 20 yards starts a row of houses. My hives are down there dotted under the trees, the bees fly up from under the trees and usually head off back up my garden and over the house. You will also see a fair number mooching around the garden.

Trevorandfiona, your situation sounds ok to me. You could erect some sort of fence/trellis/screen across the top end of your garden with the hives the other side, out of view and facing the line.

 

[Skyhook]

you most certainly can move top bar hives - don't know where that misconception came from!
(I'm someone who got to 3 colonies, 3 hives and all necessary equipment for under £150 in total going the "top bar" route)

@SkyHook

Pray tell, why can you not move a TBH? I'd like to learn what the difficulty is?

Bobster

And there was me without my tin hat! I will admit I was making a bit of an assumption there. Partly the fact that they are a lot more unwieldy, but also going on the fact that the comb is unsupported- having read about being very careful when handling comb, to ensure it doesn't break away from the top bar, I wouldn't fancy driving over a pot-hole with one in the boot, or doing an emergency stop.

 

[thorn]

Ignore the Jeremiahs. Your garden is. It enough. Site the hives so the approach is toward the railway line (perhaps at an angle so that they don't fly out straight onto the path of an express) and they'll not be flying down the garden to sting you and your neighbours every time you open the door.

 

[johnmcc]

This is the third year that I've had two hives in my back garden. All I would say is start with a nuc of doclie bees. The chap who ran the course I took also sold me my nuc. I knew his bees were friendly 'cos I'd worked with them while taking the course. Mine have (touch wood) given no trouble. I feed them in the Autumn without even putting my suit on - open the top of the hives, top up the feeders, close the hive again - the bees ignore me.

The other side of the coin is represented by a swarm I took two years ago and gave to a friend who had an old hive and wanted to take up Beek'ing again, but had no money. They were - and are - vicious bastards. They follow - three hundred yards is about the record so far, they ping all the time after the hive's been touched, and they sting like Billy-O. In September we did a last check of the hive. My friend got stung as she took her veil off, her husband and my wife who were 50 yards away got stung - they weren't suited - and we stayed indoors for half an hour before they gave up the search for us. It actually was quite scary. So get good bees and treat them right! And keep the neighbours "sweet" with the odd pot of honey. Good luck!

 

[itma]

...
The other side of the coin is represented by a swarm I took two years ago and gave to a friend who had an old hive and wanted to take up Beek'ing again, but had no money. They were - and are - vicious bastards. They follow - three hundred yards is about the record so far, they ping all the time after the hive's been touched, and they sting like Billy-O. In September we did a last check of the hive. My friend got stung as she took her veil off, her husband and my wife who were 50 yards away got stung - they weren't suited - and we stayed indoors for half an hour before they gave up the search for us. It actually was quite scary. ...

Somewhat surprised that you haven't managed to sort him out with a queen that is any better tempered.
His lot have been (and will be) sending out drones to spread those genes ...
My feeling is that it would do everyone a favour to re-queen that lot pdq.

And since you yourself have such pleasant stock ... couldn't you help?

 

[The Cumbrian]

You can probably save a lot with a top-bar hive- there are threads on here where they are discussed BUT(and it's a biggy)- you can't move them if theres a problem.

I can't quite agree with this. It depends on what vehicle you have available. I have seen a top bar hive moved.

Corks were popped into the entrances at night and the hive was lifted into the back of an estate car.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Moving TBH's?
Its not that they can't be moved, but they do need a vehicle with much more loadspace than is needed for say a National. And its always going to take at least two people to load one.
!

Also a bit of a problem getting them through a terraced house

 

[bobster]

Slightly off topic, my apologies, but ...

To say TBHs cannot be moved simply isn't true. To say they are a problem moving through a terraced house also isn't true. Certainly no harder than carrying a brood box full of bees around.

The top bars cw comb and bees can always be transferred into a box separate from the hive. The hive dismantled and then moved. Also because the hives are easy/cheap to build just make another one and transfer the bars cw comb and bees (via a sealed box) from one hive to another. Also this second method can be used to mop up any stragglers that may go back to the old hive location.

To suggest that they are somehow harder/impossible to move simply isn't the case.

Bobster

 

[johnmcc]

And since you yourself have such pleasant stock ... couldn't you help?

Never done this, I'm a newbie of three years standing and am simply happy to have two nice hives. Long may it last! One day I'll know what to do . . .

 

[Drew]

I agree with POLY totally. Bees can be good for 364 days of the year but catch them on bad day and they can have you in tears. Even putting a nose outside the back door will end up in a sting by the little bugger that had been waiting for that opportunity. Keeping bees is rewarding for the keeper but can be hell for the neighbour. No amount of honey will recompense them for not being able to use their garden. All those that say it doesn't happen just haven't had it happen to them yet. It WILL ONE DAY!!!!!
Roof beekeeping is about the only way that urban beekeeping is safe.
Ignore Poly and me at your peril!
E

Wasps rarely sting out of sheer malice. If you have been through a beehive on a bad day then bees will make sure that they sting something...What I am trying to say is that it may not happen for a few years but when it does you may end a good relationship with neighbours! I believe we all have a responsibility as keepers of bees and if there is ANY choice then my answer would be don't do it in a small garden. Sorry! Nothing wrong with a big garden where you can surrounds them with bushes and trees but .... Terrace garden? Not for me
E

That's cos you swiped them away. A bee will sting without waiting for the swipe!

Please don't think I am being negative. Give it a try but have somewhere you may be able to take them if it should fail. Good luck and keep us informed!
E

Think you are being negative!!
How on earth would we get that impression?

 

[enrico]

Ok Sorry. I have been keeping them for thirty years, just though I would air my thoughts. I would not be without them so go ahead keep them in your living room for all I care!
E

 

[Drew]

Ok Sorry. I have been keeping them for thirty years, just though I would air my thoughts. I would not be without them so go ahead keep them in your living room for all I care!
E

In your 30 years experience - how many really bad experiences have you had?

Only asking like!