Hive Choice

[gavin]

if in roman do as romans do, so smith in scotland, nationlas in wales, commercial in essex etc€

I'd say that in Scotland the commercial guys use Smiths and Langstroths largely. However Nationals are the most common amongst hobby beekeepers.

I've been working a couple of Smiths recently and I don't like them. I'm used to longer frame lugs and have dropped Smith frames while trying to hold them by one lug. They are also to bee space and so for the crown board you use the flat surface. Getting it on without squashing bees requires a different technique.

G.

 

[BBG]

Massive point about disease transfer. I totally agree


ISOLATION, ISOLATION, ISOLATION !

We're a rarity! Especially in my part of the world

 

[Erichalfbee]

I chose standard Nationals as that's what my BKA where I did my first course was using and nucs tend to come in that frame size.
I bought a flattie from T h o r n e s and a beautifully made hive from Tom Bick.
I now have one colony in a cedar 14 x 12 and hope to take the rest through the winter in a poly 14 x 12 and a cedar National.

 

[shepherd]

Thanks for the replies.I like the idea of 14x12.Now i require some advice,in about 2 weeks time a new nuc will be arriving on national frames,is it possible somehow to put these in a 14x12 or into a national brood with a 14x12 on top later on in year,or wait till next year.Would like to get new hive bought and set up by next weekend.
Advice much appreciated.

Thanks again Wayne

 

[chipper]

I use Jumbo Langstroth....
After having read every beekeeping book in Copenhagen library in 1984 ...
When I returned to Devon and finally got some bees and a hive in 1987
Br Adams thoughts influenced me greatly...
The bigger hive= more bees = more honey...Also less swarming....
Why have 2 brood boxes when One will do.....?
I did baulk at the size of the MDs and opted for marginally smaller Langstroth Jumbo....
And,I do use Buckfast derived Bees which produce BIG colonies....

 

[Baggyone]

Can do it either way but you need to really work the existing frames to get them to complete a 14x12 in time for winter. My advice is to allow the bees to have a standard BS deep as a brood box and once they have brood on 7 or eight put the 14x12 brood box on top. FEED to get them to draw it out and then swap the boxes over making sure queeny is on a 14x12 frame when you do it. Then put the queen excluder between the two boxes, allow all brood to hatch and then try and figure out a way to clear the standard deep......

Super between and a rhombus bee escape comes to mind.

My opinion on the hive type - 14x12 every time, and mine still look like outgrowing them! I now look at BS deeps as cut comb boxes.

Baggy

Thanks for the replies.I like the idea of 14x12.Now i require some advice,in about 2 weeks time a new nuc will be arriving on national frames,is it possible somehow to put these in a 14x12 or into a national brood with a 14x12 on top later on in year,or wait till next year.Would like to get new hive bought and set up by next weekend.
Advice much appreciated.

Thanks again Wayne

 

[oliver90owner]

is it possible somehow to put these in a 14x12 or into a national brood with a 14x12 on top later on in year,or wait till next year.

Deep frames will fit into a 14 x 12 (extra deep box)! Same width just a deeper box, and both National format. Simply arrange to fill the rest of the space under the deep frames and they will have no alternative to drawing further comb on the adjacent 14 x 12 ('extra deep' or 'jumbo') frames. Remove and replace the deeps as and when appropriate (may be later this year, could be next year).

If you simply put them into the 14 x 12 box, the bees will draw some wild comb rather than draw the foundation when needed. A waste of good comb building time and materials IMO, but sometimes have done it as the frames are going to be dumped anyway.

Attempting to fill a deep and a 14 x 12 at this time of the year would be folly. I have had some 14 x 12 bxes on as supers earlier (on the OSR) as a means of getting frames drawn quickly and evenly (jumbos are notoriously difficult to get drawn as perfectly as deeps and shallows).

To get the frames drawn evenly, at this time of the year (or any other, really) is best achieved with a dummy board or divider to keep the comb drawing flat. For the extra deeps, I might only give one new frame of foundation to be drawn at a time (usually two deep frames of foundation are added to a nuc, but these are obviously bigger than those by some 50%).

Hope this helps.

Regards, RAB

 

[madasafish]

I run my bees as a hobby and on a shoestring. My woodworking skills are limited as are my tools (I did buy an ebay router for £15) so I made TBHs and now warres.. although the latter taxes my skills.

The wood is reclaimed ..and all are frameless.

Now if I could make my own polyhives for very little, I'd go that way but £100 plus on a hive? No way.

King of mean.

 

[markrogers]

BBG
''The lessons of Foot and Mouth are easy to apply''.

I know what you mean in the context of bee keeping. However the fact that Mr Blair refused to allow a public enquiry, because it would reveal the Goverment's breath taking incompetence and show their appalling waste of taxpayers money, it has actually meant that, for Agriculture, the lessons have not been learnt. A tragedy!

Mark

 

[BBG]

BBG
''The lessons of Foot and Mouth are easy to apply''.

I know what you mean in the context of bee keeping. However the fact that Mr Blair refused to allow a public enquiry, because it would reveal the Goverment's breath taking incompetence and show their appalling waste of taxpayers money, it has actually meant that, for Agriculture, the lessons have not been learnt. A tragedy!

Mark

Farmers are responding in unofficial ways like ensuring clean wellingtons and vehicle wheels when visiting other farms.

Beekeepers should, respond in similar ways such as sterilising hive tools between hives, clean overalls between apiaries, visiting beeks ditto, no borrowed equipment, thorough sterilisation etc or at least some of this.

AFB has broken out in Devon near Winkleigh and apparently closer to the coast than that (but for some odd reason the person who was told couldn't get the person who was doing the telling to tell where it actually was)

Additionally, in the early 80s, I and a few others wrote to MAFF and the then government asking imports of bees be stopped and varroa be held back as it had reached the Netherlands then.

The response was obfuscation and we know the result.

People don't switch on early enough and establish preventative measures, the wait for gov' depts usually results in a cull or disaster. It's the people who are 'on the ground' and can ask for procedures.

 

[BBG]

OP:

Langstroth because he studied bees for so long and came up with the optimum size; surely.

Polystyrene due to a heap of research on here, Finland, Denmark, Germany.

Reduced cost allowed a couple more hives.

 

[sunshinemedic]

Langstroth Poly has given me excellent results and the only drawback for me has been the weight of honey laden supers!

I have also trialed a poly National this year and have been very impressed as well. Donwside of the national poly is the size of the brood box which is looking a bit crowded even though there is wall to wall brood across 10 frames.. if madge does not slow down soon, I may have to go with a brood and a half.

 

[Crg]

From a purely personal point of view I don't like long hives in the UK climate whether KTBH, Beehaus or Dartington. I think bees want to go up, not sideways but I'm always happy to hear tales from people who think that's the best type to go with.

I think bees in any climate (at least from what I've seen) don't tend to go sideways unless put into a hive where they have no choice but to go sideways by a beekeeper.

 

[Crg]

Trouble is that may include the unseen, undetected disease.
There is a developing mantra that states, "Diseases are spread by beekeepers not bees".

The lessons of Foot and Mouth are easy to apply.

That doesn't get pointed out enough.

Arguing that you should get nationals just so you can share equipment is not sensible.