Contaminating super with Oxalic?

[Chris Tel]

Last year I treated all my colonies with oxalic around Xmas time and it was really effective. Was going to do the same this year. However, as I had a really good harvest I decided to leave many of the colonies with 2 supers above the brood box.

So my worry is when I go to treat what if the bees are up in the supers what do I do?

Should I dribble into the supers-though clearly I don't want to contaminate the super/honey with oxalic

Or should I take the supers off and treat whatever bees are in the brood box?

I should also say that the bees don't get any other form of treatment other than the oxalic at Xmas as this has historically worked for me.


Any advice much appreciated

 

[Finman]

,
Oxalic syrup will not contaminate your hive or your Super.

It is naturall stuff in honey.


http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s00217-003-0698-z#page-1

http://www.apidologie.org/articles/apido/abs/2002/04/Bogdanov/Bogdanov.html

.
.

 

[Gilberdyke John]

Last year I treated all my colonies with oxalic around Xmas time and it was really effective. Was going to do the same this year. However, as I had a really good harvest I decided to leave many of the colonies with 2 supers above the brood box.

So my worry is when I go to treat what if the bees are up in the supers what do I do?

Should I dribble into the supers-though clearly I don't want to contaminate the super/honey with oxalic

Or should I take the supers off and treat whatever bees are in the brood box?

I should also say that the bees don't get any other form of treatment other than the oxalic at Xmas as this has historically worked for me.


Any advice much appreciated

Haven't we just had a thread discussing the effect (or lack of) of OA on honey?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Don't disturb the colony more than you need to - don't take supers off, OA won't contaminate honey, just do it.
As an aside doing nothing but OA at christmas is not doing your bees any favours - any damage the varroa could do has already been done, you need to combine it with an autumn IPM to ensure the bees going into winter are nice and healthy.

 

[Chris Tel]

thank you all for the really helpful advice. I'll go ahead and treat next weekend all being well and JBM I take on board your comments about incorporating an Autumn treatment.
Thank you

 

[TryingToLetThemBee]

Haven't we just had a thread discussing the effect (or lack of) of OA on honey?

Yes. Good stuff following this post http://www.beekeepingforum.co.uk/showpost.php?p=454859&postcount=26

 

[richardbees]

Chris

Just wondering why you left 2 supers on your hives as I always harvest sealed honey and store in tubs. it lasts forever and next year might be dire, you can always feed the bees syrup/fondant

r

 

[Chris Tel]

Richard, you are indeed correct and I was just being both lazy and soft. The hives in question each had 9 supers on, ridiculous I know (they were my best colonies by some way) and after harvesting 7 from each felt that it would be inappropriate to take all. In addition I wanted to avoid feeding syrup as this one apiary is some distance for me and thought that as they had done so well I would leave them with two supers.
With hindsight I should have taken them and replaced with a 12.5 kg block of fondant to see them through the winter. Anyway its been a learning curve.
That said since posting I've now decided to go with the varrox this weekend instead of trickling and my IPM will probably involve multiple autumn oxalic vaps. The latter strategy might alleviate the need for mid winter treatments altogether.

 

[richardbees]

chris, thanks for reply. 9 supers is one hell of a crop, those hives must be somewhere particularly fruitful. Probably varrox is wise as I can't see how any OA would reach the bb frames. Have a good year, Richard

 

[Arfermo]

chris, thanks for reply. 9 supers is one hell of a crop, those hives must be somewhere particularly fruitful. Probably varrox is wise as I can't see how any OA would reach the bb frames. Have a good year, Richard

BBs are normally under the supers and get dosed first?

 

[Chris Tel]

Aftermo, I think Richard was meaning that if I trickled OA through the supers then it'll unlikely get to the BB below. Hence why I'm going for the OA vap and it'll save me opening the hive up and disturbing the bees....that said I'm sure they'll be fun and games when I come to doing it this weekend.

 

[Finman]

I'm going for the OA vap and it'll save me opening the hive up and disturbing the bees.

You really believe that bees do not notice you gasification?!

.

 

[TryingToLetThemBee]

You really believe that bees do not notice you gasification?!



.

Finman, with great trepidation given I am a newbie, I will only say that the six vapings I have done have astonished me with how the bees seemed to hardly even notice. There has been a bit of discussion of this here and it seems to be a fairly general observation.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

You really believe that bees do not notice you gasification?!

.

SWMBO notices mine no matter how discreetly I sneak them out

 

[Finman]

Finman, with great trepidation given I am a newbie, I will only say that the six vapings I have done have astonished me with how the bees seemed to hardly even notice. There has been a bit of discussion of this here and it seems to be a fairly general observation.

Amen. It is better to believe so.

And general orservation is that trickling disturbes hives even if guys have not done the trickling.



.

 

[Arfermo]

Aftermo, I think Richard was meaning that if I trickled OA through the supers then it'll unlikely get to the BB below. Hence why I'm going for the OA vap and it'll save me opening the hive up and disturbing the bees....that said I'm sure they'll be fun and games when I come to doing it this weekend.

Trickling oxalic is a poorer treatment than sublimation for a number of reasons but even so the bees will spread the syrup around to a significant degree. But glad to see another convert to vaping as you call it? Still think you are leaving a bit late as there is evidence that queen laying often(?)starts even this early and vaping will likely hinder an early buildup with consequences later. This year, for the first time ever, I am giving three oxalic treatments due to the huge drops of varroa I have seen, due, I think, to the very welcome summer last year followed by a mild autumn and despite Apiguard late August. Best of luck

In passing, I have always sublimated from below the OMF. with the Varrox pan in the centre of the hive where I anticipate the cluster to be, per the instructions. However, I have noticed that the sublimated particles tend to cluster on the underside of the OMF and for that reason I suggest that second and third treatments need to be placed at other points so as to get maximum benefit from the sublimation. Any others found the same?

 

[Jimmys Mum]

Any others found the same?

Yep. And also a similar scenario with larger than expected varroa counts across most hives.

Had a hefting and feeling session yesterday (ooh-er missus), and the crown boards on two thirds of my colonies felt significantly warmer to the touch which I assumed to be an indicator of some brooding activity.

 

[midnight sun]

Trickling oxalic is a poorer treatment than sublimation for a number of reasons but even so the bees will spread the syrup around to a significant degree. But glad to see another convert to vaping as you call it? Still think you are leaving a bit late as there is evidence that queen laying often(?)starts even this early and vaping will likely hinder an early buildup with consequences later. This year, for the first time ever, I am giving three oxalic treatments due to the huge drops of varroa I have seen, due, I think, to the very welcome summer last year followed by a mild autumn and despite Apiguard late August. Best of luck

In passing, I have always sublimated from below the OMF. with the Varrox pan in the centre of the hive where I anticipate the cluster to be, per the instructions. However, I have noticed that the sublimated particles tend to cluster on the underside of the OMF and for that reason I suggest that second and third treatments need to be placed at other points so as to get maximum benefit from the sublimation. Any others found the same?

Agree with you on this Arfermo. (shocked? lol) As for the condensation of the crystals on the OMF, I found the same. So, I raised the pan closer to the floor (almost touching) and found I had much less of a problem (although not totally clear). Also, I am replacing the standard floors with stainless steel so there are no corrosion problems later on due to acid eating away at the zinc coating. (Mentioned this in some previous posting somewhere). Any that is still adhered to the mesh I just brush off with a paint brush from underneath (wet so I don't breath the crystals in).
I did 4 treatments this autumn (1 every 5 days, as Hivemaker suggested) and one this late December to make sure (when they were flying). The December treatment showed no drop on all hives apart from one that had 4 in one week. So, I call that a success. Sublimation has to be the best and most modern method of treatment for Varroa in my humble opinion.
Regards Dave

 

[mbc]

SWMBO notices mine no matter how discreetly I sneak them out

It's why farts smell, so that the hard of hearing can appreciate them too