Celotex insulation techniques

[SS_Smith]

Hi all, my first year so not sure if I've done things correctly for wintering.
(1 x National comprising of 1 x mesh base, 1 x deep for bees, 1 x Crown board, 1 x super for insulation, 1 x Roof)

So far:
1) Reduced entrance size to about 2 inches of width and installed a mouse guard.
2) Made a four sided tight fitting 50mm celotext box around both the deep and the super.
3) Added 50mm of Celotex on top of the crown board with sits between the deep and the super. I added a hole in the centre in the same place as the hole in the crown board for some ventilation.
4) Added some old loft insulation to fill the remainder of the space in the super and tore a small hole in the centre to match the celotex and crown board.
5) Put a ratchet strap over the roof of the hive and added small twig under one side of the roof to allow for a small amount of ventilation.

Does that all sound correct?

 

[Uncle Betty]

Hi all, my first year so not sure if I've done things correctly for wintering.
(1 x National comprising of 1 x mesh base, 1 x deep for bees, 1 x Crown board, 1 x super for insulation, 1 x Roof)

So far:
1) Reduced entrance size to about 2 inches of width and installed a mouse guard.
2) Made a four sided tight fitting 50mm celotext box around both the deep and the super.
3) Added 50mm of Celotex on top of the crown board with sits between the deep and the super. I added a hole in the centre in the same place as the hole in the crown board for some ventilation.
4) Added some old loft insulation to fill the remainder of the space in the super and tore a small hole in the centre to match the celotex and crown board.
5) Put a ratchet strap over the roof of the hive and added small twig under one side of the roof to allow for a small amount of ventilation.

Does that all sound correct?

Twigs instead of matchsticks is definitely more 'sustainable'.


.

 

[user 6228]

Don't insulate and ventilate at the same time.

 

[SDM]

No upper ventilation with mesh floors.
Hope you kept the hole you cut out of the celotex.

 

[Uncle Betty]

I think it's a wind-up.

 

[Gilberdyke John]

Hi all, my first year so not sure if I've done things correctly for wintering.
(1 x National comprising of 1 x mesh base, 1 x deep for bees, 1 x Crown board, 1 x super for insulation, 1 x Roof)

So far:
1) Reduced entrance size to about 2 inches of width and installed a mouse guard.
2) Made a four sided tight fitting 50mm celotext box around both the deep and the super.
3) Added 50mm of Celotex on top of the crown board with sits between the deep and the super. I added a hole in the centre in the same place as the hole in the crown board for some ventilation.
4) Added some old loft insulation to fill the remainder of the space in the super and tore a small hole in the centre to match the celotex and crown board.
5) Put a ratchet strap over the roof of the hive and added small twig under one side of the roof to allow for a small amount of ventilation.

Does that all sound correct?

Partly. If you joined the forum in July you should by now have found the forum search facility.
Holes in crownboards are only good for feeding through and making gap(s) for warm air to escape is/are foolish. In my opinion beekeepers who inflict such conditions on their colonies should be compelled to remove the loft hatch cover in their own houses for the entire year.

 

[Eyeman]

Partly. If you joined the forum in July you should by now have found the forum search facility.
Holes in crownboards are only good for feeding through and making gap(s) for warm air to escape is/are foolish. In my opinion beekeepers who inflict such conditions on their colonies should be compelled to remove the loft hatch cover in their own houses for the entire year.

You need to close off the holes in the crown board to stop your bees chewing all your insulation!
Holes in crown board are also useful for:
1. Clearing supers.
2. Place a small piece of mesh across the hole and great way to unite 2 colonies.

 

[user 6228]

The scientific reasons for why some get away with ventilating and why you should not ventilate and insulate together read the following:
Mitchell Derek. Honey Bee Engineering: Top Ventilation and top Entrances. Am Bee J. 2017;157(8):887–9.

 

[coffindodger]

Might also think about protecting the Celotex from attack by birds or squirrels. I've used builders bags over the cosy with no sign of dampness under the Celotex.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Hi all, my first year so not sure if I've done things correctly for wintering.
(1 x National comprising of 1 x mesh base, 1 x deep for bees, 1 x Crown board, 1 x super for insulation, 1 x Roof)

So far:
1) Reduced entrance size to about 2 inches of width and installed a mouse guard.
2) Made a four sided tight fitting 50mm celotext box around both the deep and the super.
3) Added 50mm of Celotex on top of the crown board with sits between the deep and the super. I added a hole in the centre in the same place as the hole in the crown board for some ventilation.
4) Added some old loft insulation to fill the remainder of the space in the super and tore a small hole in the centre to match the celotex and crown board.
5) Put a ratchet strap over the roof of the hive and added small twig under one side of the roof to allow for a small amount of ventilation.

Does that all sound correct?

No
What's the point of insulating to the far end of a fahrt then sticking holes in the top for 'ventilation' and twigs!!

A sheet of 50mm celotex over the crownboard would have been more than sufficient.
And ditch the superfluous super

 

[Jambo]

In my opinion beekeepers who inflict such conditions on their colonies should be compelled to remove the loft hatch cover in their own houses for the entire year.

..and their heating system ripped out and replaced with one whereby they have to get their family round, eat a finite amount of sugar and vibrate a bit.

Joking aside though, I do feel the manufacturers need to take the lead on this. Supplying beginners with £300 hives which are set up for top and bottom ventilation is bound to cause confusion (speaking as a beginner myself).

 

[madasafish]

..and their heating system ripped out and replaced with one whereby they have to get their family round, eat a finite amount of sugar and vibrate a bit.

Joking aside though, I do feel the manufacturers need to take the lead on this. Supplying beginners with £300 hives which are set up for top and bottom ventilation is bound to cause confusion (speaking as a beginner myself).

The makers - if they did as you suggested - would receive a tirade from people who "have done it like this for 40 years and the bees have survived and (unspoken) we don't need to learn any new tricks since we learned to keep bees in the 1960s/70s/80s and know it all."


Edit?

£300 hives? Are they gold plated ? Or does that include frames and foundation? Apologies if you have a Flow Hive which IS gold plated.

 

[SS_Smith]

Thanks for all the replies.

It was the ventilation bit that I was concerned about having read lots of advice and having watched lots of advice which all seems to contradict. A lot of people out there seem to advise even when they are beginners.

I'll take the psuedo match sticks out and plug the hole in the celotex.

Thanks all.

 

[BernardBlack]

No
What's the point of insulating to the far end of a fahrt then sticking holes in the top for 'ventilation' and twigs!!

A sheet of 50mm celotex over the crownboard would have been more than sufficient.
And ditch the superfluous super

Do you mean that's more than sufficient for the original poster... or that is more than sufficient winter insulation for any beekeeper to carry out?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Do you mean that's more than sufficient for the original poster... or that is more than sufficient winter insulation for any beekeeper to carry out?

Sufficient for any hive - all my roofs have a sheet of 40 or 50mm celotex permanently glued in place

 

[Jambo]

The makers - if they did as you suggested - would receive a tirade from people who "have done it like this for 40 years and the bees have survived and (unspoken) we don't need to learn any new tricks since we learned to keep bees in the 1960s/70s/80s and know it all."

Well indeed, but they'll be dead soon! Will pay them to look after their younger customers

£300 hives? Are they gold plated ? Or does that include frames and foundation?

It was a flippant remark but the cost of a full hive outside sales with frames and foundation and dummy boards and stand and nice gabled roof is considerable.

 

[BernardBlack]

Sufficient for any hive - all my roofs have a sheet of 40 or 50mm celotex permanently glued in place

I see.

Where would be a good place to purchase celotex and appropriate glue?

I hear that insulation stuff is irritable to work with? Any tips carrying out this insulating?

 

[Millet]

I see.

Where would be a good place to purchase celotex and appropriate glue?

I hear that insulation stuff is irritable to work with? Any tips carrying out this insulating?

Decent builders merchants sell it in 8ft x 4ft sheet or go skip mooching.
Cut it to size with a wood cutting hand saw and stick it in with some mastic/silicone job sorted.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I see.

Where would be a good place to purchase celotex and appropriate glue?

I hear that insulation stuff is irritable to work with? Any tips carrying out this insulating?

Builders merchant - 8x4 sheet - it looks like yellow foam covered in foil. it isn't an irritant, you can cut it easily with a handsaw - even a blunt one!

Ask for a tube of sticklikesh!t to fix it (you'll need a mastic gun as well) - just one blob in the middle of the roof would be sufficient

 

[Uncle Betty]

I see.

Where would be a good place to purchase celotex and appropriate glue?

I hear that insulation stuff is irritable to work with? Any tips carrying out this insulating?

Come on, man. That is just ridiculous out of you.

https://www.beekeepingforum.co.uk/showpost.php?p=610608&postcount=18

Insulation ? Maybe, possibly, potentially, feasibly, not unreasonable to assume it can be bought in a builders' merchant.

Cut it with a bloody knife. And stick it with silicone.

It isn't radioactive.