Broodless colony advice wanted

[SugarPlum]

I have just obtained a new "nuc" from someone I know (to replace one of my stolen hives). I checked the bees today, and although there are bees flying in and out, there is no hint of brood. My beek friend also checked, in case I missed something, but between us we couldn't find a single egg, larvae or sealed cell. Now my other hive has a queen that has been inadvertently laying on brood and super combs as a brood and a half. I am keen to get this colony back to just the brood box. Should I put the supers with brood from this hive into the hive with no brood at all? All the bees are healthy.

Thanks!

 

[MuswellMetro]

I have just obtained a new "nuc" from someone I know (to replace one of my stolen hives). I checked the bees today, and although there are bees flying in and out, there is no hint of brood. My beek friend also checked, in case I missed something, but between us we couldn't find a single egg, larvae or sealed cell. Now my other hive has a queen that has been inadvertently laying on brood and super combs as a brood and a half. I am keen to get this colony back to just the brood box. Should I put the supers with brood from this hive into the hive with no brood at all? All the bees are healthy.

Thanks!

Why would you want to add brood to a failing Nuc

without a laying queen it is doomed

i would recombine all and split latter into two using the super frames of brood and migrate out.

are you sure a single brood box is big enough, i have14x12s and for some bees these are small

 

[SugarPlum]

There are quite a lot of flying bees in the broodless colony, and they seem quite content. So I am assuming there is a queen, although I didn't actually look for one. I thought it might solve two problems at once: (a) ridding the brood and a half colony to just a brood box - which will help me enormously. As a newbee checking a brood and a half is very difficult, because they make lots and lots of brace comb betwen the boxes. There are only a couple of supers with brood, so not a fantastic loss if I lose them. And (b) if I add brood to a smaller colony I can watch and see what happens. If I just happen to have been given a queen and foragers but without any brood, then the addition will boost numbers. If I have been given a queenless lot, they will try and raise a scrub queen. But at least I will know then what I have and if they are worth keeping or not.

 

[Poly Hive]

As an aside, lots and lots of brace comb sounds as if the bee space is wrong.

Might be a plan to do some measuring and make sure you are not trying to run a top bee space with a bottom bee space sup?

PH

 

[Easy Beesy]

Couldn't you ask the friend who gave you the Nuc what they thought they were giving you?

 

[enrico]

Just a tip if your running brood and a half or double brood, put the second box at right angles to the first. This will stop them sealing the frames together and make life so much easier for you. It makes no difference to the bees
E

 

[Silly Bee]

There are quite a lot of flying bees in the broodless colony, and they seem quite content. So I am assuming there is a queen, although I didn't actually look for one. I thought it might solve two problems at once: (a) ridding the brood and a half colony to just a brood box - which will help me enormously. As a newbee checking a brood and a half is very difficult, because they make lots and lots of brace comb betwen the boxes. There are only a couple of supers with brood, so not a fantastic loss if I lose them. And (b) if I add brood to a smaller colony I can watch and see what happens. If I just happen to have been given a queen and foragers but without any brood, then the addition will boost numbers. If I have been given a queenless lot, they will try and raise a scrub queen. But at least I will know then what I have and if they are worth keeping or not.

If you have a lot of flying bees, you might try a frame of eggs and larvae, if there is no queen they might make one, if there is a queen it might prompt her to start laying.

Others will have different thoughts.

 

[SugarPlum]

As an aside, lots and lots of brace comb sounds as if the bee space is wrong.

Might be a plan to do some measuring and make sure you are not trying to run a top bee space with a bottom bee space sup?

PH

The bee space is wrong. I have 11 brood frames and 10 super frames, so they don't run staight. This is what makes it so difficult and why I want to get them back on just a brood box. I left the queen excluder off for a week when I added the super (which was originally below the brood box for the winter) because the weather forecast was icy to come. I didn't want them to cluster and leave queenie behind. No icy weather, but a super with eggs and larvae just one week later.

 

[SugarPlum]

Thanks Enrico. I hadn't thought of that, and it sounds like a good idea. But I think when I next visit I will make sure the queen is in the brood box and move the queen excluder from above the super to below the super and above the brood box. The nurse bees will continue to care for the small amount of brood in the supers won't they?

 

[SugarPlum]

Hi Easy Beesy, yes, I fully intend to do that! I was originally told I was getting a colony, but then told oops, not so many, just a couple of frames of brood. I will ask the question tomorrow and have a chat with them.

 

[SugarPlum]

Thanks Silly Bee. That's is my thinking too. I happen to have one other colony that isn't doing too bad at all, so I will move a frame of eggs and larvae over. If there is a queen, then I will have just boosted numbers, if there is no queen they will try and make one. But at least I will know what I have then won't I.

 

[Black Comb]

Just a tip if your running brood and a half or double brood, put the second box at right angles to the first. This will stop them sealing the frames together and make life so much easier for you. It makes no difference to the bees
E

That's interesting. It goes against what I've been taught. I'm starting some double brood nationals again this year and might try it.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Thanks Enrico. I hadn't thought of that, and it sounds like a good idea. But I think when I next visit I will make sure the queen is in the brood box and move the queen excluder from above the super to below the super and above the brood box. The nurse bees will continue to care for the small amount of brood in the supers won't they?

Yes - I was told by an acquaintance (an SBI) and had it confirmed by the RBI that the nurse bees would take care of the brood and the flying bees would cluster with the queen in the night keeping her warm

 

[sputnam]

My colonies are overwintered on at least 2 boxes, sometimes more. When I tidy up I always do it this way. The only problem is you have to let drones out of the supers every week or two.