Ivy Mustard stores

[MikeT]

I had a quick look this afternoon as it was very sunny and quite warm. All 3 hives have brood and some uncapped fresh nectar, but several frames are still full of cappped crystalizes honey. I think I should remove some and replace with foundation. (I have no drawn comb) What's the opinion of the forum on this one?

 

[jonnybeegood]

I had a quick look this afternoon as it was very sunny and quite warm. All 3 hives have brood and some uncapped fresh nectar, but several frames are still full of cappped crystalizes honey. I think I should remove some and replace with foundation. (I have no drawn comb) What's the opinion of the forum on this one?

Why not remove. & wash them out & reuse them, rather than foundation.

 

[Cazza]

I had a quick look this afternoon as it was very sunny and quite warm. All 3 hives have brood and some uncapped fresh nectar, but several frames are still full of cappped crystalizes honey. I think I should remove some and replace with foundation. (I have no drawn comb) What's the opinion of the forum on this one?

Personally I would wait until the weather is warmer before replacing with founddation. There is still time for a cold snap when the colony may need the stores.
Cazza

 

[Jed D]

UMM , I had a quick peek today, and a couple of ours are looking bunged up with stores... And yes it's Mustard.. Tastes uck..
Looking at the weather for the next week... I've left them as they were...

I did also note that the OSR is starting to grow !!! but I'm guess 3/4 weeks yet..

P.S. I also had a quick strim round some hives... And got a FAB sting , smack on the cheek... ( face ) !!!
It feels like the venom has mature over winter and is at full strength....

 

[bee ginnner]

UMM , I had a quick peek today, and a couple of ours are looking bunged up with stores... And yes it's Mustard.. Tastes uck..
Looking at the weather for the next week... I've left them as they were...

I did also note that the OSR is starting to grow !!! but I'm guess 3/4 weeks yet.

As I drove back from doing a module on Saturday I saw a field of rape near Birmingham well in flower !!!!!!!

 

[MikeT]

Too early for rape, may be mustard or charlock in flower.

 

[beeno]

Hi MikeT,
I would go with Cazza, frames worth more to you cleaned out by the bees. Also, if hives disease free then you could move stores to one that needs it later. Got some mustard as well. The farmer has only just ploughed the mustard back in and it looks as if it has been reseeded. It would not be OSR after mustard would it? Hope not.

 

[oliver90owner]

... wash them out & reuse them....

What a waste of resources! An unbelievable suggestion for a reply on the forum. Absolutely carp advice to remove honey and effectively wash it down the drain.

If the brood box is congested, it may be affecting the spring expansion and may need some relieving. One does not need to remove all the surplus and most certainly washing it down the drain would be rediculous. Retention allows replacement, if required, but to be honest, if a cold snap prevents bees flying and they are brooding heavily, a thin sugar solution would be a far better option, possibly with some protein (if pollen stores were low).

RAB

 

[MikeT]

Thanks RAB I have no intention of washing valuable supplies down the drain. I was proposing replacing 2 frames with new foundation when the weather warms up, there is 4 completely capped frames and the others have areas of capped stores around the brood nest. I will keep these frames for nucs or giving a frame to the other colonies instead of feeding. (no signs of disease in any hive) This big colony has a super under the BB which I will remove within the next week or so. I have not fed this hive at all, it was so heavy I had to stain even to lift the back of the hive.

 

[Finman]

I had a quick look this afternoon as it was very sunny and quite warm. All 3 hives have brood and some uncapped fresh nectar, but several frames are still full of cappped crystalizes honey. I think I should remove some and replace with foundation. (I have no drawn comb) What's the opinion of the forum on this one?

Washing out the crystalls is better than give foundations. Wintered bees are not good in drawing new combs.
With washing out food is value of some pounds but free brood space is much more valuable.
But put one foundation frame and look what happens. If it goes well, give another.

 

[Finman]

Thanks RAB I have no intention of washing valuable supplies down the drain. I was proposing replacing 2 frames with new foundation when the weather warms up, there is 4 completely capped frames and the others have areas of capped stores around the brood nest. .

That is really too much. Half of box is capped stores.

I think that stores are only value of sugar. Not more. One full frame has 1,5-2 kg sugar?
When you wash 2 frames, you loose 4 pounds? ..and get good new brood area and for pollen stores.

 

[MikeT]

Have now removed the super from under the BB. still plenty of capped crystalized honey present probably equivalent to 3 full frames. This was the super I put on in October for the mustard flow and then put under the BB very late. The foundation is drone, What should I do with the honey? My thoughts are, in a couple of weeks time when the rape flow is in progress put it above the BB with another super above and hopefully the bees will reprocess the honey, move it to the super above and mix it with rape honey.

Mike

 

[Bosleeu]

Had a quick look at a few hives today - bees seemed very busy. Then drove up to Cumbria for Easter to arrive in the early hours. As I got out of my car at Appleby I realised why they say it's too early for inspections or supers up here - it's freezing!

 

[Bosleeu]

Sorry - posted that in the wrong place!

 

[Finman]

Have now removed the super from under the BB. still plenty of capped crystalized honey present probably equivalent to 3 full frames. This was the super I put on in October for the mustard flow and then put under the BB very late. The foundation is drone, What should I do with the honey? My thoughts are, in a couple of weeks time when the rape flow is in progress put it above the BB with another super above and hopefully the bees will reprocess the honey, move it to the super above and mix it with rape honey.

Mike

3 frames of crystallized honey is not much. 2 frames is minimum survival kit.

I would do this way:
When one brood is full of new bees, it is time to give new space. So you give a new foundation box under the brood box. It will be douple brood. Fefore that you may take one store frame off and give a foundation.

Move store frames into the foundation box and put then in the centre. So bees get 3 foundations into upper box too. Do not split brood area with foundation. Do not put brood frame against cold box wall.

Now bees like to clean ready combs for laying, and they get fuel to draw foundations too.
So they do in nature.

Crystallized honey will be consumed mostly in wax making and larva feeding and the rest is mixed with fresh nectar.

That procedure is normal to me every spring, because hive must have allways extra stores that they can live over bad week. I can see old stores from crystallized stores, which are real honey. Syrup does not crystallize.

In douple brood is recommend job to do in some stage that you swap two brood boxes.
Then upper parts of frames will be cleaned totally for laying and combs will be used evenly as brood area.


.

 

[Finman]

.
This is normal situation in hives after spring (picture).

The frame has still old stores and upper half has not been used for brood rearing. The lower part of comb is becoming old (dark).

Douple brood is handy. You swap two brood boxes and the upper parts will be in the centre of brood area. Old stores will be recycled and combs will be consumed evenly. It is easy to give foundations continuously and no need to do sudden "frame exhange".

During flow you may use brood box with foundations as a Super. Then you get new combs for next year. and you eliminta old frames when they become dark.

Lift dark brood combs up to Super and bees emerge out. Take off old frame when it is extracted.

As you see, with brood and half it is not so flexiple to play that game what I described above.

In the middle of summer you may put excluder into the hive and your get honey frames off without brood, and bees will be in one box in winter. That is what many our professionals do in their hives.

 

[MikeT]

The frames in question are shallow super frames. The BB has about 4 full crystalizes frames.

 

[Finman]

The frames in question are shallow super frames. The BB has about 4 full crystalizes frames.

So you have shallow as BB? Or what?
Give one foundation into BB and look what they do

What ever, give space for pollen and brood.

How many frames bees occupye?

Washing shallow frames is still a good alternative.

 

[MikeT]

No I have a standard Nation BB, explained in the opening thread. Shallow under BB with at least 4 frames full of crystalized honey and the BB has 4 complete BB frames full. I have not fed this colony at all seems to be a bit too full of stores for the upcoming Rape flow.

Mike

 

[oliver90owner]

Ha ha, if put it above the brood when a flow is on they will simply add to it!

Only one place, then, for them to move it 'up'. And it is not in the brood box.

RAB