Vaping newbie

[Do224]

As mentioned in another thread, I’ll be vaping my bees for the first time any day now. I say ‘any day now’ because the chap who promised to show me how to do it keeps cancelling and re-scheduling so I may end up on my own...

I’ve ordered a Gas Vap (I originally planned to get the wand type vaper but the Gas Vap just looks so much more practical).

Can I just vape through the entrance with a tea towel blocking any gaps.,,or should I be drilling a hole and vaping through that?

Is there a minimum temp below which vaping shouldn’t be carried out?

I’ve got a super on the hive...does it matter (health wise for this year’s honey)? Should I increase the amount of OA I use accordingly? Say 3 grams...

I plan to do 3 treatments. Day 1, day 5 and day 10.

Is vaping the only treatment needed for my bees? Is normal procedure to do 3 vapes in Sept after the supers come off and then one vape in December....then repeat each year with no other treatments.

Sorry for all the questions and the lengthy post.

 

[hemo]

Ideally the weather if approx. 8 -12c means the bees may be not be so compact in a cluster. However what ever the temp once one starts the process then the 5th day and subsequent application is set in motion, one can if need be bring fwd the subsequent applications by a day but not the other way any longer.

Once the chamber is up to temp reduce the flame a little ( I place a very tiny amount in the chamber to see).

I vape under the mesh floor on a ply insert and block up the rear and some of the entrance , I prefer max vape entering the hive against a good by escaping.

 

[drdrday]

I vape through the entrance.
I block off the gap around the inspection tray at the back of the hive. I just pull the inspection tray out a couple of inches, lay an old cloth across it, and this jams into the gap when I push the tray back in. When it comes to the entrance of the hive, I usually block it off with another one of my old cloths pushed into the entrance, but to be honest, sometimes I just don't bother.
I know others vape from under the floor, or through a hole drilled through the side wall of the BB, or even from the top. However, I use a standard OMF, and found that when I tried vaping from underneath it was far more bother to try to block off the stand in some way. I could drill a hole in the side of the BB, but I don't really see a need to make a hole in one when the entrance works perfectly well.
My hives are mostly on double brood, so I tend to be a bit heavy handed with the amount of OA - but it doesn't do them any harm.
I like to have a bucket of water nearby to drop the hot caps in, and the whole gasvap when I'm finished. Personally I don't wear heat proof gloves either - I find it too awkward to do anything in gloves like that - so I simply use a soldering mat to pull the hot caps off and throw them in the bucket when I'm done, and to unscrew the gasvap from the torch nozzle so that it can just drop off the nozzle into the bucket without me touching it.

I think the Gasvap was the right choice - I bought a pan vaporiser initially, but it was such a pain to use I quickly got the Gasvap and found that so much easier.

 

[pargyle]

It's good through the top via a hole in the crownboard ....

There you are ... three beekeepers ... three different ideas . They all work. Dani has an eke with a hole drilled in the side ... that's four.

Here's the fitment I made to vape from the top ...

 

[StephenT]

Almost 3 years into beekeeping and bought a Gas-Vap a few weeks back and have been using it over the last couple of weeks. All 3 hives and 1 nuc treated with Apivar at end of summer but one hive has a much higher varroa load so doing a series of vapes on that one. 2 of the 3 hives have a Maisemore floor which means you can slide in a nice tight fitting sealed floor and then I tape over all but the middle of the entrance and vape. The poly hive extension is useful where you have landing boards on the hives otherwise you can’t get the standard nozzle into the hive. Heat up for two mins on low heat before putting the cap full of OA in and then inserting for about 30 secs. Bit concerned as they are on double brood so don’t know if it penetrates as much as on single brood. Looking through the clear crownboard afterwards they seem pretty agitated and spread out even when outside temp is about 7 degrees. Guess they react to having high temp acid particles sprayed at them.
Got one of these for safety measures
https://www.screwfix.com/p/3m-4279-half-mask-respirator-abek1p3/504hyStill learning about vaping though.

 

[ericbeaumont]

Can I just vape through the entrance with a tea towel blocking any gaps?

Yes. You'll recognise that it's not a precise science and that enough vapour does the job, even if some leaks.

Is there a minimum temp below which vaping shouldn’t be carried out?

As Hemo said in post 2.

I’ve got a super on the hive...does it matter (health wise for this year’s honey)?

No. OA has no residual effect on honey and in the sensible US it's permitted to use OA with supers on hives.

Should I increase the amount of OA I use accordingly? Say 3 grams...

Stick to the standard; although the amount used is not precise, no need to overdo it.

Is vaping the only treatment needed for my bees? Is normal procedure to do 3 vapes in Sept after the supers come off and then one vape in December....then repeat each year with no other treatments

Yes.

 

[Do224]

It's good through the top via a hole in the crownboard ....

There you are ... three beekeepers ... three different ideas . They all work. Dani has an eke with a hole drilled in the side ... that's four.

Here's the fitment I made to vape from the top ...

Fancy

I’ll just use the entrance for now I think with a tea towel around and the inspection tray in.

 

[Do224]

Yes. You'll recognise that it's not a precise science and that enough vapour does the job, even if some leaks.

As Hemo said in post 2.

No. OA has no residual effect on honey and in the sensible US it's permitted to use OA with supers on hives.

Stick to the standard; although the amount used is not precise, no need to overdo it.

Yes.

Practical, clear advice. Many thanks.

Can you ‘over vape’ the bees by doing it too regularly? For instance if you start a three vape procedure over 10 days and the weather gets very cold part way through...you might think it’s not been successful as they were likely to be tightly clustered. Can you just do another three vapes or is there a risk of harming them with too much vaping?

 

[ericbeaumont]

risk of harming them with too much vaping?

The great unknown.

You'd imagine that a chemical occurring naturally in colonies and honey would not have drawbacks, but research indicates minor larval damage by OA.

The big however, however, is that damage to colonies by varroa is far more significant.

OA is least worst option and gives a better outcome than using chemicals, which develop resistance and taint hive products.

These two links may help:

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s13592-019-00650-7https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5620704/

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

research indicates minor larval damage by OA.

by trickling, not sublimating

 

[W0otz]

It's good through the top via a hole in the crownboard ....

There you are ... three beekeepers ... three different ideas . They all work. Dani has an eke with a hole drilled in the side ... that's four.

Here's the fitment I made to vape from the top ...

Make that 4 ideas - I drilled an 8mm hole through the back bar of the floor, above the mesh. Usually bunged up with a dowel (though 8mm bolt might be easier to remove when propolised)


I tape over the slot between inspection tray and the floor back bar, mostly to stop any vapour going down through the mesh and back into my face, but I don't bother blocking the entrance. If the bees take offence and come flying out the entrance, I'm hidden round the back of the hive.

 

[nettle]

Sorry, can I ask a quick question - it seems necessary to vape several times, but from what I've read people only seem to trickle once. Is that right?

 

[StephenT]

Winter treatment is normally one trickle or vape as the idea is to mop up any varroa after the late summer/early autumn treatment. Can use OA vaping as the late summer treatment which would be 3 or 4 times to cover the whole brood cycle. Can only trickle once otherwise adverse effects on the bees.

Although, I am doing vaping one hive 3 times at 5 day intervals now as they have quite a high load even after late summer Apivar treatment.

 

[Do224]

Although, I am doing vaping one hive 3 times at 5 day intervals now as they have quite a high load even after late summer Apivar treatment.

Is it vape, miss five days and vape on the sixth....or vape, miss four days and vape on the fifth?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Is it vape, miss five days and vape on the sixth....or vape, miss four days and vape on the fifth?

vape on the fifth

 

[Arfermo]

Sorry, can I ask a quick question - it seems necessary to vape several times, but from what I've read people only seem to trickle once. Is that right?

I normally for as long at least the last 13 years only sublimated once - after Xmas. But for some weird reason have done it twice since Xmas to check the difference in dead mite load and found ................................................................................NOWT. If you really want to kill every one then multiple vaping could be the answer but I would rather cuddle up to a log fire indoors than be out in the cold.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I would rather cuddle up to a log fire

Don't you find you get a bit singed doing that?

 

[Arfermo]

Don't you find you get a bit singed doing that?

Yea ............................................but,but,but,but,but.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Is it vape, miss five days and vape on the sixth....or vape, miss four days and vape on the fifth?

Vape on days 1 6 11 and 15 if you need a fourth

 

[ericbeaumont]

vape several times, but from what I've read people only seem to trickle once.

Vaping three times five days apart kills varroa emerging cyclically with brood during the season.

Vaping or trickling once at the dead end of the year assumes that there's no brood and that varroa are phoretic - living on the bees - so vulnerable to a single treatment.

Complications arise due to warmer winters, in which case the colony is likely to have brood. A trickle will do no good because varroa will be sealed in brood cells, not phoretic, and thus safe from OA.

Instead, three vapes, five days apart, will be effective at this (or any) time of year and knock out varroa as it emerges with young bees.